Hardware N3DS NAND backup possible, I hope.

missinsummer

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Contrary to what you think, larger numbers equals smaller wire diameter. So larger number is better in this case if you are looking to get smaller wires to better fit inside the limited space of an n3DS.
I am focused more on resistance at the moment. The wire has to be thicker in order to archive lower resistance? can i have same thickness but better resistance? i thought AWG makes the material change not the thickness(or quality instead of quantity).
 

Apache Thunder

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Resistance is determined by the metal alloy/quality and how the wire is wound if it's not a single strand of copper/other metal. Usually thicker wire means higher power load capacity. (ability to drive higher wattage/voltages through wire without it breaking/overheating)

I believe thicker wires have higher resistance then thinner wires. It all depends on the voltages you are working with I would guess. The connections to the NAND are all low voltage, so thinner would be better in this case. Thicker wire means higher voltages needed to meet the same resistance value. So for a low voltage signal, thicker wires would have more resistance.

My 3DS XL's NAND mod used ultra thin wires. The kind they use in headphones. Those wires don't even use an insulator. Instead a special coating akin to paint is applied to them and using heat to melt off the tips prior to soldering is how you get around it. Unlike thicker rubber insulator where you physically remove some of it to get at the metal you are going to solder.

This allows the the wires to be extremely small. Of coarse I'm talking about the individual wires them selves. Headphones still encase the pair of wires in a outer insulation for protection. But the individual wires inside that carry the audio for left and right channels are insulated from each other using something other then rubber/material used on the outer cord. This allows them to be bunched up closer together so as to allow the outer wire covering to be smaller as a result.
 
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missinsummer

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QaCc1SYcH1ouHMLruO3dHQfegZKVTIvg4SJ28DsVKG4EjzQ9NcUTJnD51XH8mYDXKbyX-LcTzlu9jBNpNCNxtGGbqe6LHAn_J_e-nhvjVQuNdR2zMtRlzN79DwYkfplXgnAnoakVHMozxlxfMCl0flhG5rZuf1FJ6yY-PPt9HslSth9ZuGEeqxWl5C6NURAISWks8MXbpPu4Zq1GTyy4UCXm293HxZSA3sq1t2Wtj16PNN3q4shhzSjEbJWK9qg8jPPSlzvWeXOgW4CYF0BcFPzkd5F7nC6-kFu87ZmVnI4d0CsRm7b4NJIOnTKLXsPLFP8pLOrDnpe57FVUlTkvTlqUicu7fAJ9CiTACdwIF-PWJAj-D2Pbd_vMYf5hj8nHQSpfmDTSzpurx2UnHYnJAT_tf8QdZswT5EDk9AKjsrM8muR7cpDt8GrhoI3edAAlfXpfN9QhRrJb0LAy6M6bqOfKXsCumXJ9Lr3My0ma-NkbqhQuw9dfA5Z82MZp9dzJbnul5jTzvjFJxmtUndboNho3vu8TVljodsmx_oWtpnc=w1690-h949-no

does it matter if i remove the metal plate underneath the battery? it is so much easier for me to lay down the wire correctly without jamming it at some awkward position that i am not able to adjust when i put the back cover on.

the huge square hole is what i am planing using later on when i get a proper connector.

PS:i never down this kind of thing before, nor soldering , so this is the first project of my "3ds thug life" xD
 

missinsummer

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QaCc1SYcH1ouHMLruO3dHQfegZKVTIvg4SJ28DsVKG4EjzQ9NcUTJnD51XH8mYDXKbyX-LcTzlu9jBNpNCNxtGGbqe6LHAn_J_e-nhvjVQuNdR2zMtRlzN79DwYkfplXgnAnoakVHMozxlxfMCl0flhG5rZuf1FJ6yY-PPt9HslSth9ZuGEeqxWl5C6NURAISWks8MXbpPu4Zq1GTyy4UCXm293HxZSA3sq1t2Wtj16PNN3q4shhzSjEbJWK9qg8jPPSlzvWeXOgW4CYF0BcFPzkd5F7nC6-kFu87ZmVnI4d0CsRm7b4NJIOnTKLXsPLFP8pLOrDnpe57FVUlTkvTlqUicu7fAJ9CiTACdwIF-PWJAj-D2Pbd_vMYf5hj8nHQSpfmDTSzpurx2UnHYnJAT_tf8QdZswT5EDk9AKjsrM8muR7cpDt8GrhoI3edAAlfXpfN9QhRrJb0LAy6M6bqOfKXsCumXJ9Lr3My0ma-NkbqhQuw9dfA5Z82MZp9dzJbnul5jTzvjFJxmtUndboNho3vu8TVljodsmx_oWtpnc=w1690-h949-no

does it matter if i remove the metal plate underneath the battery? it is so much easier for me to lay down the wire correctly without jamming it at some awkward position that i am not able to adjust when i put the back cover on.

the huge square hole is what i am planing using later on when i get a proper connector.

PS:i never down this kind of thing before, nor soldering , so this is the first project of my "3ds thug life" xD
 

Jow Banks

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so I read all of this and maybe Im wrong but if I-

send my 9.0.0u n3ds to a trusted person to add the hard wire mod then I backup my sysnand 2 or 3 times and compare so I know it is good copy
then I can update my sysnand to 10.3.0-28 and use eshop and make cia of the games
then if I want to use my gateway I can downgrade back to 9.0.0-20

is this right?
is all of this only for once in a while or can I do this a lot of times - like when new eshop come out then go back to 9.0.0 again.
 

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I think you should keep the metal plate in place. It keeps the battery in the proper position relative to the battery terminals. You could encounter issues with the battery moving around causing an intermittent connection if you run the console with that plate removed.
 

EmceeKerser

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so I read all of this and maybe Im wrong but if I-

send my 9.0.0u n3ds to a trusted person to add the hard wire mod then I backup my sysnand 2 or 3 times and compare so I know it is good copy
then I can update my sysnand to 10.3.0-28 and use eshop and make cia of the games
then if I want to use my gateway I can downgrade back to 9.0.0-20

is this right?
is all of this only for once in a while or can I do this a lot of times - like when new eshop come out then go back to 9.0.0 again.
I guess thats correct, but I have no fucking idea why you would want to do that
You can run 9.5 and have access to the eshop, but why would you need the eshop to make cias? If youre going to pirate, just download them.
 

missinsummer

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Resistance is determined by the metal alloy/quality and how the wire is wound if it's not a single strand of copper/other metal. Usually thicker wire means higher power load capacity. (ability to drive higher wattage/voltages through wire without it breaking/overheating)

I believe thicker wires have higher resistance then thinner wires. It all depends on the voltages you are working with I would guess. The connections to the NAND are all low voltage, so thinner would be better in this case.

My 3DS XL's NAND mod used ultra thin wires. The kind they use in headphones. Those wires don't even use an insulator. Instead a special coating akin to paint is applied to them and using heat to melt off the tips prior to soldering is how you get around it. Unlike thicker rubber insulator where you physically remove some of it to get at the metal you are going to solder.

thanks so much for the information, marked.

I need a better soldering iron for sure, the one i got has huge tip....(as in post#811 showed, i am still satisfied with the result, but definitely getting a finer tip iron....)
 

EmceeKerser

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thanks so much for the information, marked.

I need a better soldering iron for sure, the one i got has huge tip....(as in post#811 showed, i am still satisfied with the result, but definitely getting a finer tip iron....)
I think a .5mm tip is recommended, as is one with temp control
 

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Note that longer wire lengths also increase resistance and probably has a higher impact on resistance then the diameter. (this all depends on the length though. Really short wires will have resistance values low enough to where wire diameter is a more dominate factor).

So for best NAND mod reliability, shorter thinner wires is best. So keep your wires as short as possible and as thin as possible. Take a look at the actual board traces that carry the NAND signals to the rest of the console. They are very thin compared to most wires. So yes, thinner = better! (with a circuit board, traces that need to carry power are usually "wider" then signal traces. Unlike wires which get thicker in a 3D space, circuit boards are 2D for the most part so to increase power load capacity wider traces are used. So in that case, wider traces would have higher resistance then thinner ones)

You'll be hard-pressed to find wire thinner then the board traces themselves. By that point they wouldn't be structurally sound. (as the circuit board provides the physical support for the traces, so they can be smaller then wires)

So the thinnest wire you can possibly find would probably be much better then using thicker wire. :D
 
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Jow Banks

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I guess thats correct, but I have no fucking idea why you would want to do that
You can run 9.5 and have access to the eshop, but why would you need the eshop to make cias? If youre going to pirate, just download them.
because you cant download anything with new crypto using that method.
hans doesnt work with it - either does the 'new' fixes for emunand - they error on new eshop games.

also I like to buy new things on eshop that not are out yet and make cia + .3ds and post them for others that cant get them
 

EmceeKerser

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If you dont have any 30 AWG wire at your disposal, Id recommend using the wires from IDE drives, thats what I used and it worked great

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

because you cant download anything with new crypto using that method.
hans doesnt work with it - either does the 'new' fixes for emunand - they error on new eshop games.

also I like to buy new things on eshop that not are out yet and make cia + .3ds and post them for others that cant get them
So crypto currently doesnt work for these new releases on the eshop? Then if you were to upgrade to 10.3, and download these games, how would you then convert them to cias. They wouldnt be registered to your NAND once you revert. And even if you converted them, they wouldnt work anyway, since crypto doesnt work
 

Jow Banks

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If you dont have any 30 AWG wire at your disposal, Id recommend using the wires from IDE drives, thats what I used and it worked great

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


So crypto currently doesnt work for these new releases on the eshop? Then if you were to upgrade to 10.3, and download these games, how would you then convert them to cias. They wouldnt be registered to your NAND once you revert. And even if you converted them, they wouldnt work anyway, since crypto doesnt work
so does that mean I should stop playing the games Im playing now that I did this before the changes to lockout eshop nov 1st?
maybe you dont know - eshops are saved on the sd card
I made cia from the sd card - removed the 9.6 crypto then made 3ds and they work fine

you do not need to be on same firmware as what is saved to the sd card to extracting cia from it
i do this even with sd cards from my friends and they have different 3ds players then mine

[hint - use seeddb.bin]
 
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urherenow

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The lock button pushes a pin inside of the reader, letting it know that it's r/w. Even without it, you should be able to see a drive and dump the nand (you just couldn't flash it). But, yea... if it fell out, it's easier to cover the slot with tape than to put those things back in.

Plug in first, then turn on, and get blue screen. That is the desired behavior. If you get a blue screen before it is connected, your wires might be too long. If you boot the system first, then plug it in, you will not get a blue screen and you most likely won't be able to read or write the nand. I wouldn't even try it that way.

But the last comment is correct. You need a compatible reader. O3DS likes some readers, and N3DS likes others... I use an Anker AR200 for my N3DS, but it doesn't play nice with my O3ds. Likewise, I use a Vivitar 50-in-1 card reader for my O3ds.
 
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larcrider

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You could completely destroy your 3ds if you aren't careful while soldering. And you could brick it if the connections aren't solid or if you flash a bad dump

But that's worst case scenario. It's a fairly easy mod to do
so the worst part is in soldering right?
if the soldering right, the worst case the device bricked, but can unbrick with raspberry pi method??

it's hard to find someone to do hardmod in my location :cry:
 

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