My view on religion.

[science]

Everyone who died before Jesus was born goes to hell, because the only way to God, is through Jesus.

I didn't read the whole post or any of the replys so this might have been said already. Christians believe that Jesus will come again to judge the living and the dead.

 

[Hitto]

I'm not anti-anything and for freedom of cult, but you gotta agree that people who have imaginary friends beyond the age of five are dangerous to a rational, logical society when they try to force others to do the same. Problem is, right now, wars are being waged because of proselytism, and there is no way to get rid of that by-product of superstition.

My main pet peeve with religion is that it's an abject laziness of the mind : why look for evidence, why prove theories when you can easily say "g.d did it"? (I'm not a religious jew at all, and I hate superstition, but man is a contradictory animal... never write His name, just in case!)

It stifles personal empowerment. Without doubt, no progress is made and without enough sense to ask yourself "what if this was all bullshit made up to control the masses?", you will dwell in your own philosophical shit, pardon my french.
It's something humanity needed a long time ago, and nowadays, it causes more problems than it solves.

 

[melloncollie]

Well Costello, I'm not looking for a meaning to my life.
I perfectly accept that there is no meaning.
In fact, it is a part of my personal philosophy that there is no meaning and that "meaning within life" is very human-egocentric. We are not the only sentient beings of importance. We do not have the ability to attach divine or secular meaning to lives or a life.

On another note I also feel that humanity as a whole is imperfect and as such is corrupt.
corruption leads to pain and suffering.
Therefore Humanity, simply by existing, causes and creates pain and suffering.
Now, I'm not saying you shouldn't live and that we all should kill ourselves.
No, rather, I'm saying that reality as we know it is harsh, fatal, and cold.

 

[jaxxster]

Religion....The greatest killer in the world

 

[chalupa]

Now, i defiantly know this post will either start a flame-war or get me verbally slapped by other disagreeing members but Christianity is a huge part of my life and it will always be. Also since Christianity is the truth and can save people form eternal damnation I feel that it is my job to find everyone who needs to be saved and introduce them to the gospel. Consider it like someone has cancer and you know the cure to save that life you would do everything In your power to make sure cancer victims can live.

this topic is important to me so I will stay on here for a bit. If anyone would like to either disprove my faith or ask questions, im ready and willing to answer and combat.

-From the Christian Fanboy


I understand your belief, but you talk as though you have been personally sent by god. Its not your responsibility to convert people or find people who need to be 'saved', and I assume anyone who isn't Christian needs to be saved right, cause we are all godless heathens going to hell and you are so much better than us.

I pray to you ohh great chalupa, save me from this life of reason and logic

Your arrogance amuses me.

Crap this is exactly what i didnt want people to start doing but oh well,
when you adress me as being sent by God to go save people, thing is... we kinda are, God sent us to go and spread the word so that people would not have to go to hell, hell was not made for humans. Dont under any circumstances think that I am trying to imply that I am better than you, just that if in the "off chance christianity just so happens to be real" that you would not have to go to hell.

As far as science vs. Christianity, I see science as a supplement to Christianity not against it. As far as evolution causing animals to have similar characteristics, I think it just shows we have a designer that uses similar ideas in everything (*example* Nintendo always uses ABXY when developing controls)

 

[Azimuth]

Crap this is exactly what i didnt want people to start doing but oh well,
when you adress me as being sent by God to go save people, thing is... we kinda are, God sent us to go and spread the word so that people would not have to go to hell, hell was not made for humans. Dont under any circumstances think that I am trying to imply that I am better than you, just that if in the "off chance christianity just so happens to be real" that you would not have to go to hell.

As far as science vs. Christianity, I see science as a supplement to Christianity not against it. As far as evolution causing animals to have similar characteristics, I think it just shows we have a designer that uses similar ideas in everything (*example* Nintendo always uses ABXY when developing controls)

I don't want to get into a whole argument here, but you say that hell wasn't made for humans, so who was it made for?

You do also realize that the odds of Christianity being the 'chosen' religion are the same as every other religion, so why is it that your religion is superior to any other.

Evolution doesn't cause animals to have similar characteristics, it is a dynamic process that functions by using the method of natural selection, animals that have an advantageous trait survive and get to breed the others don't. As these different traits accumulate, a species may split into two different species. So the strength of evolution isn't similarities its differences which determine what organism survives.

To say that a creator is responsible for organism design is jumping to conclusions, if god did create the body then why aren't we perfect. The prostate is just one example of a very poorly designed body part.

ohh and doesn't it say that the sun revolves around the earth in the bible, and that man descended from 2 individuals? how is this complementary to science.

 

[Icarus]

the most disturbing thing about religion is how one religion refuses other ones. like christianity, they believe all non-christians are gonna go to hell. same goes with islam. every non-muslim goes to hell. no matter what they've done in their life.

 

[spokenrope]

Crap this is exactly what i didnt want people to start doing but oh well,
when you adress me as being sent by God to go save people, thing is... we kinda are, God sent us to go and spread the word so that people would not have to go to hell, hell was not made for humans. Dont under any circumstances think that I am trying to imply that I am better than you, just that if in the "off chance christianity just so happens to be real" that you would not have to go to hell.

As far as science vs. Christianity, I see science as a supplement to Christianity not against it. As far as evolution causing animals to have similar characteristics, I think it just shows we have a designer that uses similar ideas in everything (*example* Nintendo always uses ABXY when developing controls)

I know that you're probably going to get crap from people, but I really understand your trying to convince non-Christians that their soul is in trouble. I probably respect you more than the people who say "Meh. I'm a Christian because it's what I want. Everybody else can choose what they want." Just like I respect the people who actually try to be Christ like instead of just going to church on Sundays, hating the gays and voting republican.

You're going to annoy me more than somebody who is quiet about their faith, sure. But I respect you more. Don't get discouraged.

 

[skullstatue]

Azimuth have you ever read the Bible? Because I have read plenty of books about evolution, and the big bang. I have watched countless shows about evolution, and the big bang. And I have been taught that evolution is fact by every teacher I have ever had. Hell was made for people that deny God, (Jesus walked in Hell when he died for three days, pretty weird) it's not good to come to God out of fear but out of understanding. In the beginning we were no different from animals (besides our intellect) until we gained the ability to understand good from evil. You're right that the human body isn't perfect, it's burdened with sin, and this sin is what kills us (the spirit of death was created when we consumed the forbidden fruit). As for people who were born before Jesus, they ended up in Abraham's bosom and will be judged after the rapture. I also don't understand the big bang, not a giant exlposion causing a pool of acid to form microscopic animals. But how can you even reach a specific point in time when there is an eternity behind you? I never really understood that. Christianity is the oldest religion, it also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events. You may also consider the Torah code, and predictions in Revelations. I don't base my faith out of evidence but out of my relationship with God and how he affects my life. Well, that's all I can type right now because I have a shit load of homework, talk to you in a couple of hours.

 

[chalupa]

Crap this is exactly what i didnt want people to start doing but oh well,
when you adress me as being sent by God to go save people, thing is... we kinda are, God sent us to go and spread the word so that people would not have to go to hell, hell was not made for humans. Dont under any circumstances think that I am trying to imply that I am better than you, just that if in the "off chance christianity just so happens to be real" that you would not have to go to hell.

As far as science vs. Christianity, I see science as a supplement to Christianity not against it. As far as evolution causing animals to have similar characteristics, I think it just shows we have a designer that uses similar ideas in everything (*example* Nintendo always uses ABXY when developing controls)


I don't want to get into a whole argument here, but you say that hell wasn't made for humans, so who was it made for?

You do also realize that the odds of Christianity being the 'chosen' religion are the same as every other religion, so why is it that your religion is superior to any other.

Evolution doesn't cause animals to have similar characteristics, it is a dynamic process that functions by using the method of natural selection, animals that have an advantageous trait survive and get to breed the others don't. As these different traits accumulate, a species may split into two different species. So the strength of evolution isn't similarities its differences which determine what organism survives.

To say that a creator is responsible for organism design is jumping to conclusions, if god did create the body then why aren't we perfect. The prostate is just one example of a very poorly designed body part.

ohh and doesn't it say that the sun revolves around the earth in the bible, and that man descended from 2 individuals? how is this complementary to science.

Hell was made for the devil when he rebelled and started a war against God.
As far as Christianity being the chosen religion in comparison to other religion's simplest thing to look at are prophecies, now if you decide to read revelation and just think wtf? keep in mind that the book was written by a man who never saw technology before so he is trying to do the best he can. example, Revelations at one point talks about locust with halo's and human faces, that would be a modern day helicopter. Also the odds that Jesus would fulfill all the prophecies of the old testament are 1times 10 to the seventeenth power. If the bible was just a story, then it was beyond extremely well written to be able to add up that well to the Torah.

As far as poorly designed organs go...... what are the odds that a human of such complexity would come out at random, with one flaw, the human body is an extremely complex thing and one organ that isn't the best is not good enough of an excuse. This could also hypothetically play into natural selection. as we now the best men dont always end up with women and i dont think i have ever heard a story of a woman asking about a man's prostate before having sex with him, thus faulty prostates could have been passed on.

I don't remember any scriptures regarding the earth rotating around the sun but if you have the address of it i would like to read it. I don't understand how humanity coming from man and woman does not make sense. Back then incest was not wrong, people migrated, adapted different traits due to conditions and different races where formed, or maybe when the world was Pangea, the continents where separated and drifted away while people where on it.

 

[trelantana]

Just like I respect the people who actually try to be Christ like instead of just going to church on Sundays, hating the gays and voting republican.

I'm not fond of those people. They claim to believe in the "New Testament", which is supposed to teach tolerance and kindness, while they practice "Old Testament" "Vengeful God" customs. They want to prosecute homosexuals, outlaw all non-Christian books like "Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone" and "A Guide to Witchcraft", and, of course, burn down schools and kill children to resurrect the devil. Actually, I made that last one up. And that "Old Testament Vengeful God" stuff is actually a bit unknown to me. I've never read the Old Testament. But just the same, these people are stupid.


Moving on:
Christianity shares its origins and many religious texts with Judaism, specifically the Hebrew Bible, known to Christians as the Old Testament.

And thus, they should share some basic characteristics. To be more specific, the idea of NOT HATING EACHOTHER.

Once again, that's a bit of an assumption on my part. I am very sorry I have made this post, as I believe it has become more of a rant than I had originally intended, and that it has also lost my main basic idea. Once again, very sorry.

 

[spokenrope]

Christianity is the oldest religion


Sigh. No. Jesus was Jewish, so that alone disproves that.

QUOTEit also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events.

I'd love to hear which events you mean and what the evidence is.

The earth being 6 thousand years old?

A single man managing to get 2 of every species of animal onto a boat?

Talking serpents? People living for hundreds of years? Healing miracles? Parting of seas? Water into wine? Pi being exactly 3?

Faith is fine. But common sense alone disproves much of the events of the bible. So it has to be faith that one rests these beliefs on, not facts.

 

[chalupa]

Christianity is the oldest religion


Sigh. No. Jesus was Jewish, so that alone disproves that.

it also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events.

I'd love to hear which events you mean and what the evidence is.

The earth being 6 thousand years old?

A single man managing to get 2 of every species of animal onto a boat?

Talking serpents? People living for hundreds of years? Healing miracles? Parting of seas? Water into wine? Pi being exactly 3?

Faith is fine. But common sense alone disproves much of the events of the bible. So it has to be faith that one rests these beliefs on, not facts.

If you are talking about carbon dating, is inaccurate. when something is older than 16 thousands results are extremely off. a shoe found from the civil war was carbon dated at about 36 thousand years old. not very effective

also the worlds oldest tree is roughly 42 hundred years old, the sahara dessert took about 42 hundred years to form, and for niagro falls to erode far back enough to be at it's current state it would take about 42 hundred years, and according to the bible the flood happened about 42 hundred years ago. 2 of every species would be possible to the long lives that people lived back then, people lived longer thanks to jewish law that forbid eating unclean animals (pigs, lobsters, crabs, ect.) allowing for people to live healthier. Also at some point that i dont remeber exactly (sorry) god placed a curse on man that would not allow them to live past a certain age.

 

[melloncollie]

Paganism.
Any form of which is far older than Christianity.
please, don't muddle facts with your ignorance.
(I don't mean ignorance in any offensive way; I just mean it in its literal term)

So, wait, you believe in Pangea?
That was 250 million years ago.
Yet, your Bible states that Earth is not but 6000 years old.
How can that be?

I'm sorry but far too many logical, rational evidence and conclusions that go against any form of mystic religion.

 

[spokenrope]

I'd like to see sources for the inaccurate carbon dating. That'd be interesting to see.

Aside from that, there's still ice cores, geological formations, and oh, say, light from stars more than 6000 light years away that point to the earth being more than 6000 years old.

And if people did live longer, it'd still be pretty difficult to gather up 2 of every animal seeing as new species of animals are still being discovered to this day. Not to mention the impossibility of fitting these animals on a single ship and still making it sea-worthy.

 

[Bowser128]

Christianity is the oldest religion, it also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events.

How do you work that one out? Christianity is based on Judaism, which spans back a fair few years, but you seem to have ignored all non-Judaism based ancient societies.

As far as poorly designed organs go...... what are the odds that a human of such complexity would come out at random, with one flaw, the human body is an extremely complex thing and one organ that isn't the best is not good enough of an excuse.

You seem to have misunderstood the concept of evolution, it is the exact opposite of random. Having the most advantageous traits in a species (a cheetah being particularly fast for example) mean an animal is more prosperous and is able to mate more, so only those 'best' traits get passed on. It's an incredibly slow process, but it is far from random.

 

[Azimuth]

Azimuth have you ever read the Bible? Because I have read plenty of books about evolution, and the big bang. I have watched countless shows about evolution, and the big bang. And I have been taught that evolution is fact by every teacher I have ever had. Hell was made for people that deny God, (Jesus walked in Hell when he died for three days, pretty weird) it's not good to come to God out of fear but out of understanding. In the beginning we were no different from animals (besides our intellect) until we gained the ability to understand good from evil. You're right that the human body isn't perfect, it's burdened with sin, and this sin is what kills us (the spirit of death was created when we consumed the forbidden fruit). As for people who were born before Jesus, they ended up in Abraham's bosom and will be judged after the rapture. I also don't understand the big bang, not a giant exlposion causing a pool of acid to form microscopic animals. But how can you even reach a specific point in time when there is an eternity behind you? I never really understood that. Christianity is the oldest religion, it also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events. You may also consider the Torah code, and predictions in Revelations. I don't base my faith out of evidence but out of my relationship with God and how he affects my life. Well, that's all I can type right now because I have a shit load of homework, talk to you in a couple of hours.

merely reading and watching don't mean shit if you don't understand the concept and evidence backing it up, Big-bang theory is much debated and there still isn't a definitive solution, the newest addition is the expansion theory(the beauty of science is that it evolves with our increased understanding, unlike you know what).

Hell is just a tool used to guilt and scare people into believing crap they otherwise won't, fire is used because it is a primitive fear that people 2 thousand years ago could easily comprehend. You would think god with all his wisdom could come up with something a little more creative.

The perfection I was talking about isn't sin and such, it is the fact that our bodies have numerous physical shortcomings, but since we were created in god's image i dont see how this could be.

Umm Christianity isnt the oldest religion, here is a brief list: Buddhism, Taoism, Hinduism, Judism(you mentioned the torah, so wtf?)

Big bang didn't cause microscopic organisms, it created the universe from a single explosion of infinitely dense matter occupying a point in space. What you are talking about is the creation of rudimentary life in the early earth, caused by interaction of lightning ammonia CO2 nitrogen and oxygen to create primary organic compounds, this has been reproduced in a lab, thus verifying the hypothesis.

Yup Christianity is super accurate, http://ezinearticles.com/?Questions-Your-P...-Hate&id=103223

If you have a relation with an old guy in the sky, thats all you man. Im not going to interfere with that

 

[Dirtie]

As far as poorly designed organs go...... what are the odds that a human of such complexity would come out at random, with one flaw, the human body is an extremely complex thing and one organ that isn't the best is not good enough of an excuse.

You seem to have misunderstood the concept of evolution, it is the exact opposite of random. Having the most advantageous traits in a species (a cheetah being particularly fast for example) mean an animal is more prosperous and is able to mate more, so only those 'best' traits get passed on. It's an incredibly slow process, but it is far from random.

No, that's "Natural Selection" which is undeniably fact with even creationists agreeing.

 

[Edster]

It's taboo to criticize religious faith or any convictions born from it. Religions are the area in which we tolerate dogma uncritically. To deny the holocaust ever happened, or to assert you're in dialog with extraterrestrials is pretty much synonymous with craziness in our culture. This is so because we challenge people when they strongly believe in things without evidence or in contradiction to a mountain of evidence ... except on matters of faith.

So let me get this straight. There's this invisible being called God. And this God is fully aware that 1) he never physically shows himself to anyone and 2) there's not more evidence for his existence than there is for unicorns. And yet under those conditions I'm expected to believe in him, and if I don't, I'll be damned to a fiery hell for eternity after I die, despite living a life of kindness, generosity and love for others? What a rip off! This outlines ONE of the many reasons why I'm an atheist. Its not that I choose not to believe in a god. You don't consciously CHOOSE to believe in something or not. You either do believe, or you don't. And I don't. My mind is just not capable of believing in something so ... extraordinarily ridiculous to me. Magical and invisible beings that can hear your thoughts may seem normal to others, but not to me. It angers me when people ask why I choose to be an atheist. I didn't CHOOSE to be an atheist! BELIEF IS NOT A CHOICE. I can't choose to believe in God! Can you choose to believe that my toenail clippings made the universe? Going to hell for INHERENTLY not believing in God just doesn't make any sense. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. I haven't mentioned walking on water, rising from the dead, or a talking bush. If I told those stories to a child, they'd most likely believe it. Children believe anything, which is why I think it's dangerous to teach those biblical stories as FACT. It amazes me how many grown adults believe in these magical, fairytale-like stories. I guess when you hear these stories over and over again, and are brought up being taught that these stories actually happened for a fact ... you tend to lose the sense of absurdity. The whole bible is filled with hundreds of examples of ... crazy things happening. No offence to Christians (or else I'd be offending a HUGE number of people), but I just can't understand how someone can devote their lives to something so crazy and truly "believe" the majority of what the bible says. If only you can see it from my eyes ...

Creationists usually find some sort of scientific statistics to help back up their argument. Or they bring in the laws of thermodynamics and all this talk about missing links. Some Christians even believe that dinosaurs lived alongside man at one point in history. Now that's just going really low. But why not bring up the more meaty topics like a burning bush that talks to people? Explain that. And don't tell me Moses was on hallucinogens. And tell me if rainbows are really a sign from God to remind us of the great flood. But the truth of it all lies in ... absurdity. We can nitpick at the little contradictions in the bible, but it's easier to look at it as a whole. If you look at the big picture ... you should see something wrong with it all ... with the whole notion of religion.

I shouldn't have to say all this to begin with, because the burden of proof is not on me. People forget that they were born an atheist; the default position. If a person claims something, they are obligated to support it and no one is obligated to prove them wrong. If a claimant cannot provide that support, then the default position of disbelief is justified. The requirement of rational, logical support for a claim is very important. The methodology of skepticism, critical thinking, and logical arguments is what allows us to separate sense from nonsense; when a person abandons that methodology, they abandon any pretense of trying to make sense or engage in a sensible discussion.

Just something to think about:
Take 100 million Hindus, 100 millions Buddhists, 100 million Sikhs, 100 million Muslims, and 100 million Christians. So that's 500 million people in total. Since only one religion can be real, that makes 400 million people (80% of the population) wasting their lives in worshipping something that never existed. They might as well be worshipping my toenail clippings. Everyone can agree that religions are man-made. A Christian would say Hinduism is bogus and was the idea of a creative man, and a Hindu would say Christianity is bogus and was the idea of a creative man. I created this imagry to illustrate that the majority of religious followers, are wasting their lives. Of course everyone is stubborn, and would like to think that they themselves aren't wasting their time because they believe in the TRUE god. In actuality, it's much more reasonable to deduce that ALL religions are man made ... instead of ONE being real and the rest being copycats.

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" - Carl Sagan

If a baby dies, he/she goes to hell.
Everyone who died before Jesus was born goes to hell, because the only way to God, is through Jesus.

Man, I ramble a lot. BTW, I used to be a Christian ... I just saw the light eventually.

Dude I agree with you 100%.

One thing religion never teaches anyone is to believe in themselves.

Just because someone says it's a fact, doesn't make it a fact (Penn & Teller).

My wie and her family are big time Christians. I don't get it. I don't go to church as I don't belive in it. For me to go to church would be hypocritical. I don't believe in it and I don't know how anyone could. I really don't get it in this day and age. For their only answers to life's mysteries is the old "It's not meant for us to understand" or "we are not capable of understaning" or the best one "God works in mysterious ways"

I've always said to them it's great to have a Religion that says you can do whatever you like all year round and them get forgiven for all your sins. What a joke!!!!

 

[chalupa]

I'd like to see sources for the inaccurate carbon dating. That'd be interesting to see.

Aside from that, there's still ice cores, geological formations, and oh, say, light from stars more than 6000 light years away that point to the earth being more than 6000 years old.

And if people did live longer, it'd still be pretty difficult to gather up 2 of every animal seeing as new species of animals are still being discovered to this day. Not to mention the impossibility of fitting these animals on a single ship and still making it sea-worthy.

when god sent Noah to get two of every animal he ment two dogs two ants two cats, not two african bull ants, two jack rusle terriors. kinda generic stuff. I saw a video clip with the stuff about carbon daiting, i will see if i can go find it for you.

Christianity is the oldest religion, it also is one of the only religions to explain past events accurately and also to be supported by geographical events.

How do you work that one out? Christianity is based on Judaism, which spans back a fair few years, but you seem to have ignored all non-Judaism based ancient societies.

As far as poorly designed organs go...... what are the odds that a human of such complexity would come out at random, with one flaw, the human body is an extremely complex thing and one organ that isn't the best is not good enough of an excuse.

You seem to have misunderstood the concept of evolution, it is the exact opposite of random. Having the most advantageous traits in a species (a cheetah being particularly fast for example) mean an animal is more prosperous and is able to mate more, so only those 'best' traits get passed on. It's an incredibly slow process, but it is far from random.

yes Christianity is based on Jewdism. thats why Jews that are converted to Christianity tend to have more indepth knowledge than your standard Christian.

But that does not mean a negative trait cant be dominant and mask a more favorable trait.

I have to go to bed so i will continue this more tomorrow.