"As far as the ex-muslim thing is concerned, Im sure that I ,a non-believer, know more about islam then you do."
That, right there bothers me a lot, you don't even know anything about me. not even my name BUT you believe that your better then me. Your being so ignorant its off the charts. Seriously I just joined this topic to say my point of view, not to be insulted by someone who believes hes greater then me.
"I don't know how this proves the quran had big bang theory but obviously this guy speaks arabic better than me.... except that he doesnt."
Same thing for that which is even worse then assuming your better then me. Saying someone who's life revolves around Quran and religion and has probably been studying the Quran for 40 years or so knows less Arabic then you is just disgusting but maybe that "except that he doesn't" part was just a typo?
Being an X-Muslim I thought you would know why we memorize the Quran with out learning It's meaning. One is to first worry about earning the Arabic tongue, so that you don't F' up the pronunciation and 2 You haven't forgotten how to pray have you? You remember having to recite 2 surats one being Fatiha and the other being of your choice for the first 2 rakkah's? So obviously you would first memorize a couple surats so you can start praying. While i was at Dugsi we were slowly taught Arabic so that we could understand the language. any of the Arab born students need this but there were others (such as myself) Who never had Arabic as there mother tongue.
Also the Hijab thing
Surah an-Nur ayah 31 states:
And say to the faithful women to lower their gazes, and to guard their private parts, and not to display their beauty except what is apparent of it, and to extend their headcoverings (khimars) to cover their bosoms (jaybs), and not to display their beauty except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband's fathers, or their sons, or their husband's sons, or their brothers, or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their womenfolk, or what their right hands rule (slaves), or the followers from the men who do not feel sexual desire, or the small children to whom the nakedness of women is not apparent, and not to strike their feet (on the ground) so as to make known what they hide of their adornments. And turn in repentance to Allah together, O you the faithful, in order that you are successful
The word Hijab may not be mentioned but khim?r is. (They both mean the samething)
Nice twist on words there, nice try but try harder
Also The Hadith being not 100% true, well your not wrong but your not right either. Being an X-Muslim you must have taken some History Seerah and Hadith classes before right? So then you would know what tests a Hadith must undertake to proven Hassan or better (Good).
I dont want to say it wrong, but Ill try my best. Dont take my words for being 100% accurate. The sources of where the writer got the hadith from is tracked, and the history of that person is checked if he is known to be a liar. For eg) The Prophet said who was heard by blank who told blank who told blank who told blank who told the writer. All of the people ( the blanks) History would be checked and If they were a liar or a theif or if a link in the chain is missing then it would not be considered as an authentic Hadith.
Also an Extract from our faithful freinds at Wiki
Some modern Islamic scholars believe that the Qur'an parallels the Big Bang in its account of creation, described as follows: "Do not the unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together as one unit of creation, before We clove them asunder?" (Ch:21,Ver:30). The claim has also been made that the Qur'an describes an expanding universe: "The heaven, We have built it with power. And verily, We are expanding it." (Ch:51,Ver:47).[35] Parallels with the Big Crunch and an oscillating universe have also been suggested: "On the day when We will roll up the heavens like the rolling up of the scroll for writings, as We originated the first creation, (so) We shall reproduce it; a promise (binding on Us); surely We will bring it about." (Ch:21,Ver:104).
Seems like something about everything once being one then being released to me ...
Also the moon thing
Sura Al-Furqan 25:61 which says,
Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies,
And placed therein a lamp
And a moon which has reflected light.
I dont really get where you got the word Moonir from ... but none the less Ive brought you proof I haven't edited anything Its all in front of you.
Also to the thing that world never knew this before (or specifically us) of course we knew, don't you know of the Golden age of Islam? Our science and math was once leading the world until we slowly started losing our roots and living our life for greed instead of worship. Also even if we didn't know that proves nothing its already a well known fact that the Quran hasn't been altered for 1400 years so If was written down then thats all that matters. It wasn't possible for them to figure this out back then but yet it was written down.
Dr. Zakir Naik hasn't lied or bent the truth, youve just misunderstood. I'm not gonna start attacking you for the sake of letting this topic run and the fact that I really want to hear what you got to say to this one.
Also I hope you know these facts were just put In there (I'm guessing cause I obviously cant out think God) to prove how authentic the Quran is right? These parts do not really help us in our worship of God but just strengthens or faith.
Also just in case you do go there, being an X-Muslim yourself, you do remember your teacher telling you that our prophet was a Illiterate right? So there's no way he could of wrote this himself.
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Section for the Mod dude
"So the earth is the testing area...
.. who's the moderator? Not me I hope, I've already got my hands full.
Seriously, I have a hard time with the whole "I will be invisible to you so that you can choose to be faithful" thing. In my opinion, if God was worth his salt, he'd pop in every once in a while and say, "Hey guys, I exist!" and give everybody a legitimate choice. And by "once in a while" I don't mean every 2000 years. Really how hard would it be. Feeling his presence just isn't enough, do something, anything that can't easily be brushed away as a feeling. Sometimes I think somebody's behind me, and I turn around and there's somebody there, sometimes there isn't, feelings are deceptive that way, you either know or you don't, and knowing means experiencing with our senses. So God just needs to do something tangible and concrete. I don't need a fuzzy transparent God. If he's truly "all that" he'd be able to end the confusion pretty quick, and without a ton of people going to hell because they didn't trust their "feelings" as fact. I mean hey, Jesus let Thomas feel his wound, and didn't condemn him to hell for doubting. That's all I'm talkin' about. Even Jesus the historical figure is elusive. From what I've read anyway, the only historical records of him come from the Christians, and nobody else of note has any records of his existence at all. Fuzzy... and it's hard to take a devoutly religious person's word for anything, because they have a vested interest in their "truth". So until something of substance happens, I'll just go about my way and not think about it too much."
lol, If I argue with the mod will i get on his bad side? lol but here we go
umm BTW did you read all the other posts? cause I remember this being answered somewhere else but w/e.
The whole thing about earth as a testing ground is true so why would God want it to be so easy by just you know yelling out to the world "Hey I'm God WORSHIP MEEEE" sort of defeats the purpose of a test doesn't it?
I really don't want to go any farther cause I obviously ain't a Scholar when it comes to this, I really suggest you get pop a visit to your local mosque and ask them a few questions test their minds a bit see if you can out question them, It would be good both ways seeing everyone would walk away with new or reinforced knowledge but I'm pretty sure the members of GBAtemp aren't that great when it comes to religion and posting on message boards about religion wouldn't really be that helpful to you it probably create more topics like this...
Hope that helped