Li-ion batteries could soon charge 10x more, 10x faster

[qlum]

I would see this tech being used to give devices physically smaller batteries and some more power consuming cpu instead of actually increasing the battery life like with basically all battery tech before it. Because of this and the fact that the gain of this type of battery halves after 150 cycles we may even end up with devices that have a shorter battery life ones they age a bit. The planned 5 years is still a long way to go who knows what other tech gets released in the same timespan which may even be better or cheaper or maybe some big problem with the battery is found in the meantime preventing it from release so all I can say about this is like always wait and see.

 

[chartube12]

I would see this tech being used to give devices physically smaller batteries and some more power consuming cpu instead of actually increasing the battery life like with basically all battery tech before it. Because of this and the fact that the gain of this type of battery halves after 150 cycles we may even end up with devices that have a shorter battery life ones they age a bit. The planned 5 years is still a long way to go who knows what other tech gets released in the same timespan which may even be better or cheaper or maybe some big problem with the battery is found in the meantime preventing it from release so all I can say about this is like always wait and see.

Like the 50 core intel cpu that runs at one teraflop...check gizmondo cause i'm not joking.

 

[Bladexdsl]

if they put this in an iphone it'll still need to be charged every 2 days if your lucky

 

[Mangofett]

This was developed at the uni I go to, and I'm just now hearing about it... oh well

 

[Foxi4]

Who cares about batteries when we can use hydrogen fuel cells, they have twice the capacity retaining the same size and charge in 10 minutes.

 

[Gahars]

Who cares about batteries when we can use hydrogen fuel cells, they have twice the capacity retaining the same size and charge in 10 minutes.

Except that hydrogen is currently very expensive and difficult to obtain, so that isn't really feasible.

 

[alphamule]

The real limitation is thermal, not chemical. I've looked into making my own circuits for lithium cells and the requirements are pretty extreme. You can very easily create a firetrap by not following the requirements. There must be a thermostat. There must also be a temperature sensor(thermistor). There must be a current sensor (special ADC+resistor). There must be an automatic cutoff for over/undervoltage conditions. You MUST NOT use a charger with the wrong chemistry of cells. No, not all lithium battery packs use the same voltage range per cell... Mess this up and you'll end up with swollen/burnt (or just undercharged) cells. Soldering them isn't trivial either.

The point is, that no matter how much of a charge the individual cells can hold in a given volume, they're still only going to survive charging between a range of 2 temperatures. Although, I've never heard of someone having a problem with them being too cold when charging them!

 

[Foxi4]

Who cares about batteries when we can use hydrogen fuel cells, they have twice the capacity retaining the same size and charge in 10 minutes.

Except that hydrogen is currently very expensive and difficult to obtain, so that isn't really feasible.

You do realize that you can obtain Hydrogen from water or brine in the process of electrolisis relatively easily and low-cost? What do you think German blimps were filled with?

In fact, I've alreadty seen "small versions" of such "chargers" made by Angstrom. It's NOT expensive at all.

Motorola is actively working with Angstrom to bring this solution to your pockets since late 2006 I believe.

The phone itself is obviously slightly outdated, but it's only a prototype to show the use of the fuel cell. The slits on the back exhale water vapour from the chemical reaction, the first picture shows the "hydrogen charger".

As you can clearly see, the cells themselves are also relatively small compared to a standard battery.

 

[alphamule]

New: Runs on ETHER!!

Hehe, actually I think hydrogen is slightly more flammable than ether.

 

[Foxi4]

New: Runs on ETHER!!

Hehe, actually I think hydrogen is slightly more flammable than ether.

Actually, the idea is that it's supposed to be easy to oxidize rather than "light it up". That would be... rather irresponsible.

Heat is of course still created, but there is no "flame" involved.

Since air rather than pure oxigen is used and the temperature is elevated, the "water" is removed from the cell simply as vapour which is hardly noticable and in low quantities.

 

[Veho]

What do you think German blimps were filled with?

I don't think that's really the association you want to invoke (see signature for details ).

 

[Foxi4]

What do you think German blimps were filled with?

I don't think that's really the association you want to invoke (see signature for details ).

The correlation I was trying to make was "Blimp = HUGE ammounts of Hydrogen", and since Germans learned that Hydrogen is not the best gas to choose for floating machines the "hard way"... you can only really think of German blimps when talking about hydrogen, lol.

As endorsed by Chef Excellence:​

"An Excellent Landing"​

 

[Veho]

The correlation I was trying to make was "Blimp = HUGE ammounts of Hydrogen"

But the correlations people will make are "hydrogen = fire" and "fuel cells in mobile phones = Hindenburg in my pants".

 

[Foxi4]

The correlation I was trying to make was "Blimp = HUGE ammounts of Hydrogen"

But the correlations people will make are "hydrogen = fire" and "fuel cells in mobile phones = Hindenburg in my pants".

That's why I said the battery does not involve any flame sources.

In all factuality, it's less dangerous then the Li-Ion ones you have right now - THOSE are pretty freaking reactive when punctured or overloaded. Ever seen a Lithium fire?

[yt]pizFsY0yjss[/yt]

This is yet another reason why I dislike the original design of the 10x Better Li-Ion battery. The battery has miniscule holes, the lithium it contains is reactive with H20 even in ammounts as small as the ones in air ---> Boom as soon as it starts to rain a bit?

How is the battery insulated and how successful this insulation is? I want someone to throw a prototype into an aquarium and show us what happens with it.

 

[Gahars]

*snip*

I could be wrong, but the hydrogen gas used to fuel the Hindenberg came from fossil fuels like oil; that's easy enough, but you're still paying for the (now pretty expensive) oil. The more renewable way of obtaining hydrogen, from water, requires a lot of energy.

As for these small versions of chargers... they're prototypes, so there isn't a real way to know what the market price would be or exactly how much the money the companies have put into them.

 

[Foxi4]

*snip*

I could be wrong, but the hydrogen gas used to fuel the Hindenberg came from fossil fuels like oil; that's easy enough, but you're still paying for the (now pretty expensive) oil. The more renewable way of obtaining hydrogen, from water, requires a lot of energy.

As for these small versions of chargers... they're prototypes, so there isn't a real way to know what the market price would be or exactly how much the money the companies have put into them.

It is my firm belief that a massive company like Motorola wouldn't invest years of studies into an energy source that would be expensive to use in a mobile device.

You already have cars fuled with Hydrogen, so it can't be THAT expensive to produce.

 

[Gahars]

*snip*

I could be wrong, but the hydrogen gas used to fuel the Hindenberg came from fossil fuels like oil; that's easy enough, but you're still paying for the (now pretty expensive) oil. The more renewable way of obtaining hydrogen, from water, requires a lot of energy.

As for these small versions of chargers... they're prototypes, so there isn't a real way to know what the market price would be or exactly how much the money the companies have put into them.

It is my firm belief that a massive company like Motorola wouldn't invest years of studies into an energy source that would be expensive to use in a mobile device.

You already have cars fuled with Hydrogen, so it can't be THAT expensive to produce.

If it's an experimental side project... yeah, it can happen. Companies take chances and experiment with different ideas hoping that they will pan out in the end; sometimes it works, other times it doesn't and gets shelved.

As for the cars, they are prototype, proof of concept things mostly made to get investors and the press on board. Only a good handful actually exist; there simply isn't a way to mass market them yet.

 

[SifJar]

Wow this is very interesting to say the least. I was thinking that batteries can't evolve due to their set voltage of amps that the company produce overtime. Now looking at this information it makes me wonder how 'safe' is the battery under high temperatures?

"voltage of amps" - huh?

How awesome would it be to have a laptop that lasted hours rather than days?

Not overly...And I don't think there are currently many that last days

 

[Foxi4]

Wow this is very interesting to say the least. I was thinking that batteries can't evolve due to their set voltage of amps that the company produce overtime. Now looking at this information it makes me wonder how 'safe' is the battery under high temperatures?

"voltage of amps" - huh?

How awesome would it be to have a laptop that lasted hours rather than days?

Not overly...And I don't think there are currently many that last days

Amperage, and he meant the other part the other way around - working for days, not hours.

Also, @Gahars
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_vehicle

There be plenty Hydrogen cars and there be stations too.

 

[SifJar]

Wow this is very interesting to say the least. I was thinking that batteries can't evolve due to their set voltage of amps that the company produce overtime. Now looking at this information it makes me wonder how 'safe' is the battery under high temperatures?

"voltage of amps" - huh?

Amperage, and he meant the other part the other way around - working for days, not hours.

Amperage = current = not voltage. Voltage is the energy transferred by electrical charges. Current is the speed of those charges. (Essentially). Therefore what he said makes no sense, at least from what I understand.

And I knew the other guy meant the other way round, I was just pointing it out