Joe Biden is now officially the 46th President of the United States of America

[tthousand]

The people who don't want to say black lives matter seem quite happy for police to single them out and kill them. So I don't know if I buy your argument.

Seems like a very prejudice comment to me. Again with labeling and lumping everyone together. There will never be another me, and there will never be another you. We might share similarities, but we are all different. Step away from the stereotypical labeling.

 

[Julie_Pilgrim]

this! I have a particular distain for him (more than any other right wing nut/ trump supporter i met) how he became a mod is beyond me but i guess those in a seat of power tend to show their true colors especially if there is 0 repercussions for that said person

I mean, he's not a bad mod, even if his politics opinions are..... divisive

 

[Foxi4]

I mean, he's not a bad mod, even if his politics opinions are..... divisive

Wait till you hear my spiel on organ sales!

 

[smf]

Seems like a very prejudice comment to me.

You appear to not understand what prejudice is. You can acknowledge that there are groups of racists without being prejudiced towards them.

I never went to a blm protest, never did the whole blm meme on social networks, but I understand that being able to bring myself to say that black lives matter means that I'm not racist. I of course know that all lives matter and at some point it will be ok to have that conversation.

Unless you have something pressing that is important for us to know about how your life matters, then you should go along with it.

 

[tthousand]

You appear to not understand what prejudice is. You can acknowledge that there are groups of racists without being prejudiced towards them.

But when you start making broad accusations, like saying "The people who don't want to say black lives matter seem quite happy for police to single them out and kill them," that is prejudging a whole lot of people. How do you not see that? I can feel like BLM is a marxist hate group funded by Soros money, but at the same time feel there is injustice being done to black people not only in our country but around the world. Just because I think BLM is a big facade doesn't mean I think anything less of someone with a different skin tone than me.

Are you gonna go down to the hood in the big city at night? I don't think so. Have I been there? You bet.

So again, out the prejudice labeling away, and save the self-righteous bigotry. This is the internet, so of course the kiddies are gonna act tougher than they are. Bring your big talk to the streets and see how far you get without showing proper respect.

 

[smf]

Just because I think BLM is a big facade doesn't mean I think anything less of someone with a different skin tone than me.

You seem very prejudiced against BLM.

 

[tthousand]

You seem very prejudiced against BLM.

Antifa, KKK, BLM, Proud Boys... yeah, I do not care for any of them. That does not mean I have anything against the color of someone's skin. Far from it... I just think these groups have agendas I do not personally agree with. I doubt they are what you think they are. All you see is the tip of the ice burg. You do not see what's lurking beneath.

To reiterate, as I have said before, I have had more friends of a darker skin tone than I have had friends of a lighter skin tone. Personally, I just don't care much for most people. I feel like the majority of people either have their heads up their own asses or just don't really care about anything in general where they are worth my time.

 

[Lacius]

The root of the problem is that you're acting like an Internet bully asking people to bend the knee before you, the implication being that if they refuse to do so, they're racists and their opinion, however valid, can be discarded. In life you'll learn that certain people kneel before no one and keep their head up high, high enough to let you swing without any measurable effect. That's neither here nor there though, this weird thought experiment of yours has nothing to do with the Biden administration, the topic of this thread.

1. It's not bullying to ask, in a conversation about race in the United States, if one thinks black lives matter. I think you're confusing bullying for just not liking what I have to say or ask.
2. I'm not asking anyone to bend the knee before me, literally or figuratively.
3. I never said nor implied anyone was racist or that anyone's opinion can be discarded. It is absolutely my prerogative, however, to not have or continue a conversation with someone who can't say black lives matter. It's my prerogative to not have a conversation with someone for any reason I want. It's not unreasonable to think a conversation is futile if the other party cannot say black lives matter as a starting point. If, in a conversation about LGBT rights, a person couldn't say gay lives mattered, I'd probably end the conversation right then and there, and rightfully so. There can be no common ground in that situation.
4. Even deplorable people with deplorable views can hold their heads up high in the face of public disdain. It doesn't mean they aren't deplorable or wrong. It only means they're unwavering, which isn't always a virtue.
5. Are you saying, as a moderator, that we need to get back on topic? That's fine, and I'd agree, but you will note that I've said "I have nothing more to say" and "I think I've said all that needs to be said" and "At least we don't have to keep talking about this anymore" numerous times before this, and you pulled me back. There are also approximately 17 posts over 48 hours from you talking about race as much as, if not more than, anyone else here, and I considered this conversation tentatively done hours ago. I am going to assume that you aren't flexing your moderator status now, arbitrarily, just because you didn't like what I had to say. If you don't like what I have to say or ask about race, assuming it's in a relevant place, you can always just ignore me. Hypothetically, if you can't help but respond to everything I post, or if you can't help but put on the moderator hat when the conversation gets hard, that would show poor judgment.

 

[tthousand]

Remember GBATempers, it's easier to point out flaws in others that you have within yourselves.

@Foxi4 , thanks for pointing out how far off topic this thread has become. All though, Ben Hiden has to be one of the boring-est presidents ever, if not thee. I can see why people would rather discuss something else than the stupidity that is "our great leader". I mean, I feel like Trump has been mentioned more than President Harris in this thread.

The guy is a failure, and he is weak. Of course he is either going to destroy our country and/or serve our corporate overlords. American is the land of consumerism, and the majority of the people will buy anything that is thrown at them. Left, right... the only unbiased news these days is coming from the random dude in his basement.

Personally, I agree with what Joey said in his corona birthday special, "I miss Trump"... we all would rather have Trump back at this point. At least the leftists would have someone to point the finger at and call the bad guy.

Old Ben Dover has some big shoes to fill. By this time in Trump's presidency, he was already about to start making huge peace deals all across the world. All old man aviator has done is divide the country more, including the people who voted this clown into office.

 

[Foxi4]

1. It's not bullying to ask, in a conversation about race in the United States, if one thinks black lives matter. I think you're confusing bullying for just not liking what I have to say or ask.
2. I'm not asking anyone to bend the knee before me, literally or figuratively.
3. I never said nor implied anyone was racist or that anyone's opinion can be discarded. It is absolutely my prerogative, however, to not have or continue a conversation with someone who can't say black lives matter. It's my prerogative to not have a conversation with someone for any reason I want. It's not unreasonable to think a conversation is futile if the other party cannot say black lives matter as a starting point. If, in a conversation about LGBT rights, a person couldn't say gay lives mattered, I'd probably end the conversation right then and there, and rightfully so. There can be no common ground in that situation.
4. Even deplorable people with deplorable views can hold their heads up high in the face of public disdain. It doesn't mean they aren't deplorable or wrong. It only means they're unwavering, which isn't always a virtue.
5. Are you saying, as a moderator, that we need to get back on topic? That's fine, and I'd agree, but you will note that I've said "I have nothing more to say" and "I think I've said all that needs to be said" and "At least we don't have to keep talking about this anymore" numerous times before this, and you pulled me back. There are also approximately 17 posts over 48 hours from you talking about race as much as, if not more than, anyone else here, and I considered this conversation tentatively done hours ago. I am going to assume that you aren't flexing your moderator status now, arbitrarily, just because you didn't like what I had to say. If you don't like what I have to say or ask about race, assuming it's in a relevant place, you can always just ignore me. Hypothetically, if you can't help but respond to everything I post, or if you can't help but put on the moderator hat when the conversation gets hard, that would show poor judgment.

I pointed out that the conversation has gone off the rails quite some time ago and that the only person actually trying to stick to the topic now is @Valwinz, which I find hilarious. It is well-within my jurisdiction to permit that if I believe there is something interesting or worthwhile to gather from a brief diversion. Since all of the current participants of this conversation have now seemingly responded to your query, the side plot has reached its natural conclusion. I have no issue with what you have to say about race, and by your own admission you've said all you had to say already. In addition to being a moderator, I also have the gift of impeccable timing - the debate regarding BLM is getting circular and has outlived its usefulness, to the point that a discussion about frog lives somehow entered the conversation. A conversation about race relations could arguably be tied to a conversation about the administration since the current race riots are taking place under the administration's watch and the government is responding to the situation. A conversation about whether or not people are willing to use magic spells of your choice to somehow prove their worth to you, albeit briefly amusing, is far removed from the topic. I hope this explanation is satisfactory.

 

[tthousand]

...but that does not mean I think a frog's life matters as much as a human's life.

... frog lives [matter]...

 

[Lacius]

Ben Hiden has to be one of the boring-est presidents ever, if not thee.

Boring is a good thing, particularly when we are contrasting him with the previous president.

has been mentioned more than President Harris in this thread.

Vice President Harris.

The guy is a failure, and he is weak.

Biden and the Democrats passed a major piece of legislation only two months into his presidency. It took Obama much longer than that, and one could argue the former president never did that (that depends on how you view the tax cuts largely for the wealthy).

Of course he is either going to destroy our country and/or serve our corporate overlords.

There's no reason to think Biden is going to destroy the country or serve "our corporate overlords." There's a reason corporations, for the most part, prefer Republicans over Democrats: They don't want to pay higher taxes or deal with more regulation. There's reason to think corporations aren't going to like what Biden and the Democrats have planned.

we all would rather have Trump back at this point.

Speak for yourself. A majority of Americans approve of Biden's job so far (about 53%, to be specific).

Old Ben Dover has some big shoes to fill. By this time in Trump's presidency, he was already about to start making huge peace deals all across the world. All old man aviator has done is divide the country more, including the people who voted this clown into office.

The former president had an approval rating of about 41% at this point in his first (and only) term. I'm also curious what "huge peace deals" the former president accomplished.

 

[tabzer]

*off topic*

 

[Foxi4]

Can you quote where you read that? I have been following the conversation and I didn't come to that conclusion at all. I saw many try to "put words in his mouth" because he didn't decide to play jury on manslaughter/murder. Also, nobody seems to mention that the person who was shot at was a violent and potentially armed criminal. Instead, you claim the opposite, lol.

I think we've moved on from that topic now, unless you *really* want to roll it back to the recent shooting and the resulting riots in a way that actually relates to Biden's administration. I'd say we should probably wait and see what the administration does about the matter, if anything at all. The National Guard seems to have it on lock now that they've stepped in and the city effectively instituted Martial Lite with a strict curfew, which in turn led to large swathes of arrests. Could've used rapid response like that last summer, but then again, we had a different president back then, and politics are often about the optics.

 

[tabzer]

I think we've moved on from that topic now, unless you *really* want to roll it back to the recent shooting and the resulting riots in a way that actually relates to Biden's administration. I'd say we should probably wait and see what the administration does about the matter, if anything at all - the National Guard seems to have it on lock now that they've stepped in and the city effectively instituted Martial Lite with a strict curfew, which in turn led to large swathes of arrests. Could've used rapid response like that last summer, but then again, we had a different president back then, and politics are often about the optics.

Sorry, I just woke up and responded to something directed to me.

 

[Plasmaster09]

all the less-than-artful dodging these guys have been doing regarding systemic racism seems to have aged like milk WHILE THEY WERE TRYING TO DODGE IT, what with adam toledo and all
it's like mold spontaneously growing on a piece of bread right as you're about to eat it
oh and btw
saying black lives matter doesn't mean you're saying other lives matter less
it means that you aren't a bigoted prick and that you do actually believe that black lives matter just as much as others
refusing to say it, or repeatedly dodging the question, is an indicator that you're not only a bigot but a coward

 

[tabzer]

I think that's just being bossy and isn't really considering the fact that people can and do say things that they don't believe all the time. Just like *insert current administration*.

Some people think that paying lip services detracts from the importance of action.

 

[Foxi4]

all the less-than-artful dodging these guys have been doing regarding systemic racism seems to have aged like milk WHILE THEY WERE TRYING TO DODGE IT, what with adam toledo and all
it's like mold spontaneously growing on a piece of bread right as you're about to eat it
oh and btw
saying black lives matter doesn't mean you're saying other lives matter less
it means that you aren't a bigoted prick and that you do actually believe that black lives matter just as much as others
refusing to say it, or repeatedly dodging the question, is an indicator that you're not only a bigot but a coward

Can't believe we're back at it again, but fair enough - there's a "new" (to some) element to the discussion. Am I the only one who was already aware of the shooting? The details have been released what, 18 hours ago? More than that. It doesn't change my calculus - young teens running around with weapons sadly isn't unusual in Chicago, which is precisely why it needs more stringent policing. Still a bad shoot, but it's very clear that Toledo ran towards the fence specifically to dispose of the luger and hide, and if the visibility was poor I can see the officer making a poor split-second decision. It's regrettable, really.

The problem I have with this train of thought is that both you and @smf treat these words as some kind of magical spell, which is precisely why I call it that. What a load of croak.

I never went to a blm protest, never did the whole blm meme on social networks, but I understand that being able to bring myself to say that black lives matter means that I'm not racist.

This implies that saying the phrase requires an inordinate amount of effort, you need to "bring yourself to say it" (it doesn't), but just by the virtue of saying the magic words you are automatically absolved of racism, hallelujah! Uhm, no - those are just words. More specifically, it's a catchphrase of a group of activists that has proven time and time again to pursue their goals by using violence and intimidation (for financial gain, mind), and I refuse to kowtow to strangers on the Internet requiring me to use their arcane passwords in order to participate in a serious discussion about race. In addition, it causes you guys to fall into a tail spin every single time, so the refusal has additional benefits in the form of entertainment.

At this point I will make a conscious effort to never say it, even on accident. That's not indicative of whether someone is racist or not, this crazy standard is simply bizarre. What other truism are people required to utter in order to be worthy? "Sir, please confirm that murder is bad"? Poppycock. You can choose to debase yourself when prompted to, I choose not to.

 

[mammastuffing]

Just like to point out:

Perhaps ALL lives are important? Or is that racist to not single out an entire spectrum of people based on the tone of their skin color?

I think you are missing the point.

Saying that black lives matter isn't about any individual person or actions.
It's about a systematic oppression of part of a population because of the color of their skin.

And it is a completely independent proposition from if ALL lives matter. If you want to propose that all lives matter, that's fine. I think most people would disagree though, considering for instance how life is treated when it comes to animals for example.

But in the independent proposition of "Do black lives matter", the answer for me is YES - Black lives matter. Do white lives matter? Yes! But white lives aren't threatened by a system of oppression so there isn't a problem.

 

[smf]

This implies that saying the phrase requires an inordinate amount of effort, you need to "bring yourself to say it" (it doesn't),

Some people can't say it because of the conflict it creates in their brain.
For those people it does require an inordinate amount of effort.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance
In the field of psychology, cognitive dissonance occurs when a person holds contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values, and is typically experienced as psychological stress when they participate in an action that goes against one or more of them. According to this theory, when two actions or ideas are not psychologically consistent with each other, people do all in their power to change them until they become consistent

For example you might hold these two beliefs.
Racism is bad, I'm not racist.
Black lives don't really matter, most murdered black people are murdered by other black people. They deserve it.

The easiest thing to do would be to argue about why you aren't racist, but that there is no reason to actually say that black lives matter.

Making excuses why you won't say it makes you look like you can't say it without causing inner conflict.

Of course saying it doesn't absolve you from anything that would be ridiculous.