1. Xzi

    Xzi GBAtemp's Resident Plok Expert
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    Context is also important here: Trump was fine with starting an all-out war with Iran, you'd have to be prior to targeting someone so high-profile. Biden was only looking to fire warning shots, as he's soon going to be back at the negotiation table with Iran to discuss a new nuclear treaty.

    Texas would like a word. Of course, that's just the latest and most blatant example of Republicans leaving the "little people" to fend for themselves in a crisis, it's obviously not the only example. How Ted Cruz reacted to a three-day freeze is exactly how you can expect most Republicans to react to worsening natural disasters across the country as a result of climate change.
     
  2. Plasmaster09

    Plasmaster09 Social Justice Potato
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    Texas? Try "the entire fucking nation since the pandemic started". We've discussed time and time again how Trump willfully refused to actually treat the coronavirus as seriously as it needed to be treated, and that really should be enough evidence of "the far right is built off of extraordinary selfishness" for almost anyone.
    Not for Trump supporters though I guess... :/
     
  3. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    That's interesting. When Trump was still president, his "lack of a plan" was delivering approx. 1 million vaccinations per day by the end of his term.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-dose-a-day-goal-sets-a-bar-that-s-nearly-met

    Biden recently boasted that as of February 25th 50 million doses were administered.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/25/joe-biden-coronavirus-50m-vaccine-doses

    Now, I'm not a math major, but he's been in office since January 6th. That's 50 days between when he took office and February 25th, not "37" as he mentioned in his speech. Not only did distribution not ramp up significantly at all since Trump, he very well may be falling behind given the upward trend we saw before - I'd have to see how the growth curve looks like to determine that. He's not "weeks ahead of schedule", regardless of how many times he says that he is.

    The "100 million doses in 100 days" was not a lofty goal - the country was on track to reach that number in that time frame *before* he even took office, and the accelerating number of vaccinations per day is within expected parameters.
    Biden authorised the strike on foreign soil without congressional approval. You can claim that Trump "wanted a war" with Iran until the cows come home, what you're not accounting for is political theater. At the end of the day, Trump is the *only* president who *didn't* start a new conflict since Carter, if I recall correctly. In fact, he was advocating for the withdrawl of forces from areas where they have no business being. Meanwhile, Biden is more than happy to sign another deal with Iran for a vague promise that they "won't develop nuclear arms" when they're actively funding terrorism in the region, with the express intention of killing American troops. If you don't see the warning signs of the U.S. becoming the world's policeman again like in the "good old days", I don't know what to tell you.

    The record so far is very clear to me - the "new COVID plan" is no more effective than the one that was already in place, bombs are still dropping in the Middle East on sovereign soil, still no COVID relief in sight (since that well is poisoned as usual) and the children are back in the cages since, as it turns out, there *is* a crisis at the border, who knew.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...dfd58c-7533-11eb-8115-9ad5e9c02117_story.html

    At least he doesn't Tweet though, it's important that Biden never installs the app, am I right?
     
  4. jupitteer

    jupitteer self loathing millia player
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    "are people really upset we bombed a foreign country we have no reason to be in???????????????????" headass
     
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  5. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    Hey, 15 days to flatten the Kurds. 100 drone strikes in a 100 days, what could go wrong.

    For the record, I *personally* don't mind terrorist dens getting blasted, I'm merely pointing out that big crowds here seemed to be against that for the last four years, and they seem to be changing their tune now that their guy is in. All I want is consistency.
     
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  6. chrisrlink

    chrisrlink Has a PhD in dueling
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    remember folks red was always bad even before trump trump just made it 100X worse and we're still feeling the after effects what i fear the most is the SOTU address coming up after Jan 6th I always worried about it even the Mayor of DC said their were "credable threats" of another attack during that time (it's worse cause people are actually carrying out these attacks or show more willingness too after trump left the WH)
     
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  7. Xzi

    Xzi GBAtemp's Resident Plok Expert
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    Is that relevant? I don't remember Trump asking Congress' permission for the Soleimani assassination either.

    That was not theater. Both Russia and Israel wanted the US to be their proxy in a war with Iran, and Trump would've been more than happy to oblige in his second term when there would be nothing left for him to lose from it. The only reason war profiteering wasn't his first priority is because he was already conning so many rubes out of their money here at home. And that well may still not have run dry yet, I guess we'll see in 2024.

    There was nothing vague about the previous treaty, the US and its allies had full access to frequent inspections. Dropping bombs on them wouldn't stop their nuclear program, if anything it would make them commit even more resources to it and be more inclined to utilize those nuclear weapons once they've been developed. So I'm not sure what you think the alternative is here.

    There was no plan in place previously. The federal government under Trump was actually a hindrance to quick distribution of the vaccine, that much was obvious. He immediately lost what little interest he had in his duties as president once he lost the election.

    Huh? The COVID relief package already passed the House, we're just waiting for the inevitable passage of it through reconciliation in the Senate.

    He's not moving to reform immigration policy as quickly as I'd like, but the policies of mandatory family separations at the border and criminalization of asylum seekers have already been overturned by executive order. And while immigrants need to be housed somewhere while being processed through CBP, there's no reason to make those facilities as inhumane as possible like Trump did. New facilities are being built with showers, beds, all the basic necessities that immigrants were denied over the last four years.

    At least he doesn't try to set government policy via Tweet at 3 AM after snorting a line of Xanax, you mean. That does help to keep the nation's collective blood pressure under control.
     
  8. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    It is, because it makes the two moves nearly identical. You were outraged by one, but you're excusing the other.
    Russia is a giant on clay legs with a GDP the size of Texas. The country is in no way capable of undermining the position of the United States, and pretending otherwise is the Red Scare nearly a century too late. Soleimani was responsible for far more egregious crimes than the bunch of militants Biden blasted, I have zero sympathy for him or the Iranian regime, but there needs to be a consistent standard here. If you put Trump's feet to the fire over an unauthorised strike on a literal war criminal, you should be outraged now as well.
    If you actually believe that the treaty was effective in any shape or form then there's really nothing to discuss. Me, I don't negotiate with terrorists, but if you prefer American troops to be killed using American money as opposed to Iranian money then go ahead, give them more dollars based on empty promises.
    Total nonsense that was already denied by Faucci himself.

    EDIT: Out of plain curiosity I checked the graph, courtesy of Our World in Data, and as I expected, Biden's new plan did not cause a sudden increase in vaccinations - the number grows following pretty much the same trajectory as under Trump, with significant dips in late January and mid-February, possibly due to poor weather.

    _20210228_235736.JPG
    The package is full of pointless spending including causes in no way related to the pandemic. I will not be surprised if Republicans cause a huge stink over it, although admittedly, the Democrats control both houses, so it has a good chance of being approved in the Senate. It only took two months.
    Correction, facilities they were denied for the last 12 years, since those detention centers were established under Obama's and Biden's watch.
    Sadly.
     
    Last edited by Foxi4, Mar 1, 2021
  9. Xzi

    Xzi GBAtemp's Resident Plok Expert
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    I'm not excusing anything, just pointing out the differences in motive. As I already explained to Valwinz, the bombs will continue to fall as long as every president we elect is a staunch capitalist beholden to the military-industrial complex. With that as a baseline, all we can compare them on is how many new wars they start or don't start.

    Under Trump our stance on Russia was whatever Putin wanted it to be. The same is true of Israel and Netanyahu, as well as Saudi Arabia and their royal family. They all had strings firmly attached to the presidency, which is why Trump was still asking about his authorization to bomb Iran even after losing the 2020 election.

    Tsk tsk, deeming an entire nation of individuals "terrorists" just because some of their leadership is attempting to develop nuclear weapons? Or perhaps it's because you think the US' religious extremists are somehow morally superior to religious extremists in the Middle East? Either way, a bit of your neocon is shining through the cracks.

    More specifically, Fauci called the Trump administration's plan for a vaccine rollout "vague." That's the closest you're gonna get to a career CDC doctor saying they were fucking clueless.

    Well we already tried throwing trillions at corporate welfare last year. For some odd reason, that didn't make the pandemic immediately and completely disappear. :rolleyes:

    That's fair, though the Obama administration didn't have a policy of family separation, and the influx of immigrants coming from South America during the Trump administration required the construction of additional facilities. Those facilities were left as bare-bones as possible, with nothing but concrete floors to sleep on surrounded by steel fencing. Hell, they even went to court to argue that immigrant children didn't need showers, soap, or toothpaste.
     
  10. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    Who's doing the negotiations - "entire nations" or the governments in power? The United States are not giving hand-outs to the Iranian citizens, who I'm sure are good people - they're giving it to the Iranian government, the Ayatollah to be specific. The Iranian people aren't crowdfunding terrorism, the Iranian government is funding it, and destabilising the Middle East in the process. By handing money to the Iranian government as part of a "nuclear deal", you are in effect funding terrorism in the Middle East, terrorism that is primarily aimed against your own people. That's not "neocon", that's 2+2=4.

    "Corporate welfare" isn't supposed to stop the virus, it's supposed to prevent businesses from shutting their doors permanently and leave large swathes of the population unemployed after their state governments prohibited them from operating. Funding a bunch of new museums is not a COVID relief priority, and yet somehow it's in there - that money should go towards keeping businesses that cannot open right now afloat. There's a bunch of other nonsense in there as well, which you're welcome to look up in your own time.

    If we're talking about Faucci's words, he said specifically that "Biden is not starting from scratch" and he laughed at the notion that "there was no plan", it was a developing situation, and it develops still.

    Not much to add in regards to your other points - I was simply told that improving border security wasn't a priority until it was after January 6th. You seem to be consistent in terms of military interventions, so I have no issues with that - you stand for something, consistently, which is good.
     
  11. smf

    smf GBAtemp Psycho!
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    What do you mean "as I expected"? It sounds passive aggressive. As if you're telling us something that only you could know.

    The time it would have made a difference was 6 months ago, but there was a grossly incompetent president in the Whitehouse at the time. The roll out is not great and is in spite of Donald Trump.

    So yeah, as everyone expected.
     
    Last edited by smf, Mar 1, 2021
  12. stanleyopar2000

    stanleyopar2000 Dirty Weeb ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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    This conversation proves one thing:

    We need a 3rd party to win this time....:wtf:
     
  13. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    I meant precisely what I said - I expected the graph to look a certain way, I looked it up and the trend looks exactly as I anticipated it would. How you choose to interpret that is up to you.

    You'll also have to define some parameters on what constitutes a bad roll-out. 20% of Americans are either fully or partially immunised now, that's pretty quick considering vaccinations started in December.
     
  14. Xzi

    Xzi GBAtemp's Resident Plok Expert
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    This is all awfully presumptuous of you. Until a new treaty is established, we won't know what the US is willing to give in exchange. As far as the treaty Obama established goes, we only ever returned to Iran their own funds which were frozen by the US. We essentially got what we wanted for free, but Trump wasn't smart enough to understand that. Or perhaps he was, and his desire to spite Obama simply overruled his desire to follow diplomatic best practices.

    Wal-Mart and the like were never in any real danger of shutting their doors permanently, and Republican-proposed relief efforts thus far have provided little to no support for small businesses. Biden's relief package does include funds for small businesses, as well as a whole lot of money to re-open schools safely and to assist in the vaccine rollout. I'm not opposed to a few new museums either, as I'm sure my tax dollars have gone to much worse endeavors.

    I wouldn't say I'm opposed to military intervention under any and every circumstance, but the last time the US was in the right for entering into a foreign conflict was probably WW2. So it's been a hot minute.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Mar 1, 2021
  15. smf

    smf GBAtemp Psycho!
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    It seems I interpreted it exactly as the posturing you intended.

    As vaccine rollout schemes take longer to implement than Biden has been in power then it would be obvious that there would be little change and why there is little change. So no disingenuous arguments please.

    Slower than the UK.

    They were late to that party as well because they didn't want to get involved, Japan forced their hand. I'm sure in their version of the movie they are the good guys, but it's not so clear to me.
     
    Last edited by smf, Mar 1, 2021
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  16. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    Money they shouldn't have received regardless, not for as long as they're involved in destabilising the region and funding terrorism. It's worth noting that the deal also included interest on the frozen assets, so no, it wasn't just the money that was frozen, the figure was well in excess of the original amount.
    That's a weird parameter. As far as vaccinations per 100 are concerned, both countries are at the top of the list. Israel (1st), UAE (2nd), UK (3rd) and the US (4th) are leading the charge in terms of global vaccine roll-out, nations in the European Union are lagging far behind. The admirable performance of the US in this regard can be attribited in no small part to Trump's administration which laid the groundwork for a speedy vaccination scheme.

    _20210301_102504.JPG
    They're doing pretty well in spite of "having no plan", as Biden's administration likes to falsely claim. Not sure how fast you want them to distribute it. My point of contention wasn't slow distribution, rather it was the fact that Biden's new plan isn't any better in terms of results in a way that could be statistically measurable when you look at the results. It's literally a straight line.
     
  17. smf

    smf GBAtemp Psycho!
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    If you hold a ruler up to your screen between january 1st and january 25th & compare it to now, then it's nothing like a straight line. Biden released vaccine that was being hoarded by Trump and ordered more, which hasn't been delivered yet.

    https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n246

    President Joe Biden announced on 26 January that he had purchased 200 million more doses of the two authorised vaccines

    The Biden administration said that beginning next week it would increase by 16% the supply of vaccines distributed to states, tribes, and territories from 8.6 million doses per week to a minimum of 10 million doses, allowing more people to get vaccinated sooner than previously anticipated. It said that it would maintain this as a minimum supply level for the next three weeks with the supply expected to increase in late March. The recipient states, tribes, and territories will now get three weeks’ notice of what deliveries to expect, instead of the previous one week, to improve planning.


    It seems his plan is going as well as expected bearing in mind what he inherited from the idiot president. It would be impossible to turn round the disaster of the last four years in less than four months.
     
    Last edited by smf, Mar 1, 2021
  18. Foxi4

    Foxi4 GBAtemp's Biggest Women Respecter™
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    I already did, in the earlier post. There are no significant dips or spikes until the two I mentioned, only standard variability. There's no significant curvature to speak of, the graph follows an established trend. For the record, the reason why you don't see one is because you can't - vaccine distribution is, and was, in large part up to the individual states which have their own procedures based on guidance received. Case in point, if you want to talk about vaccine hoarding, look no further than New York, where Cuomo botched this so hard they had to dispose of expired doses altogether since the state chose to strictly adhere to a queue, at the threat of hefty fines.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/10/nyregion/new-york-vaccine-guidelines.html

    Talk about a bipolar governor - first he introduces a $1M dollar fine and threatens revoking licenses for what he calls "vaccine fraud", as in vaccinating an individual who is not yet eligible to receive a dose, then he introduces *another* fine of $100k to hospitals that fail to use up their supply in time, and threatens to cut off future supply. In other words, you can only vaccinate people from the list, but if not enough people from the list show up, you're responsible for the spoiled supply, even though you can't vaccinate people who are not on the list and request a jab. You have to throw your excess away and pay for it. Good job.

    https://nypost.com/2020/12/28/gov-cuomo-ag-to-probe-vaccine-fraud-vows-1m-fines/
    https://www.businessinsider.com/new-york-covid-vaccine-hospitals-fine-doses-andrew-cuomo-2021-1

    If this guy somehow keeps his seat after his cavalcade of blunders, there's no hope for the state.
     
  19. tabzer

    tabzer Newbie
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    What a dumb and uncultured thing to say. You act like Japan isn't allowed onto the internet and that you have no way of verifying your racist assumptions before spouting them.
     
  20. Plasmaster09

    Plasmaster09 Social Justice Potato
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    This has nothing to do with anything.
    It's one giant ad hominem attack with a side of deliberate misinterpretation and some whataboutism drizzle on top.
     
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