If dreamcast has a ps1 emulator, why can't dsi?

Discussion in 'NDS - Emulation and Homebrew' started by spyro3dsguy, Dec 3, 2011.

  1. spyro3dsguy
    OP

    spyro3dsguy GBAtemp Fan

    Member
    304
    62
    Nov 28, 2011
    Canada
    I've done some research on the specs of the two systems:

    DSi: Dreamcast:


    CPU: arm9 133MHz main CPU/ arm7 33MHz secondary CPU RISC CPU: 200MHz Hitachi SH4 RISC

    RAM: 16MB PSRAM RAM: 16MB RAM

    ...And i've found a ps1 emulator on the dreamcast:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBILGMrph3U&feature=related

    So if dreamcast and dsi basically have the same specs, and the dsi is hacked, why is there no ps1 emulator for it?

    And how much more capable is the dreamcast's CPU to run ps1 games than the dsi's?
     


  2. omgpwn666

    omgpwn666 Guy gamer and proud!

    Member
    2,547
    306
    Jun 14, 2008
    United States
    Florida
    Not worth putting a PS1 emulator on the DSi since it's not gonna get much farther than graphical glitches and sound flaws. Just my opinion.
     
  3. Buleste

    Buleste Old Fart

    Member
    852
    27
    Dec 19, 2010
    Learn how to programme and then have a go.
     
  4. indask8

    indask8 New Member Forever

    Member
    987
    119
    Apr 19, 2007
    France
    Look at the Flag...
    You forgot that the Dreamcast CPU architecture isn't the same as the DSi ARM architecture,

    Also the dreamcast has a GPU (PowerVR) with 8MB of video ram which the DSi doesn't have (and if I recall, DC has a FPU built in, ARM cpu (the one on ds/dsi) doesn't have one).

    Finally, the dreamcast emulator (bleemcast) was made by guys who were pretty much professionals, they had a company, while most other emu are made by guys just like you and me who have some spare time.
    This is why the DC emu is very fast.

    A PS1 emulator on DSi isn't impossible, but it will simply be too slow to be usable, or will take too much time to create..
     
    1 person likes this.
  5. DiscostewSM

    DiscostewSM GBAtemp Guru

    Member
    5,018
    2,658
    Feb 10, 2009
    United States
    Sacramento, California
    I'm assuming you are looking at the DSi CPUs, and just adding them together for a theoretical 166Mhz. That is not how it works, and even if it did, it would still fall behind the Dreamcast.

    One other thing is just graphics themselves. The PS1 incorporates 1MB of video RAM. The DS/DSi has 656KB of video memory, 512KB of it allowed for textures. The Dreamcast has no problems with this and its 8MB of video memory. A minor problem is screen resolution too. 320x240 of the PS1 vs 256x192 of the DS/DSi.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. Ace Overclocked

    Ace Overclocked My CPU's hot but my core runs cold.

    Member
    2,107
    288
    Jul 30, 2010
    Italy
    Somewhere
    *facepalm*
    the dsi can't even emulate the snes proprely without the dstwo, how can it emulate the ps1?
     
    2 people like this.
  7. Rydian

    Rydian Resident Furvertâ„¢

    Member
    27,883
    8,108
    Feb 4, 2010
    United States
    Cave Entrance, Watching Cyan Write Letters
    You can't compare shit by mhz/ghz.

    Older Processors.
    The "Intel Pentium 4" 2.26ghz processor scores 282.

    Newer Processors.
    The "Intel Core 2 Duo P7350" 2.00ghz processor scores... well you'd expect it to score twice as much as the single core processor and a bit less because it's "less ghz", right? Nope. It scores 1,401.
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. BORTZ

    BORTZ "Another stunning Van Gogh"

    Supervisor
    11,592
    14,365
    Dec 2, 2007
    United States
    Pittsburgh
    ARM processors are mobile and absolutely nothing like a full blown standard console GPU.
     
    2 people like this.
  9. nl255

    nl255 GBAtemp Addict

    Member
    2,571
    360
    Apr 9, 2004
    Even the Vita can't emulate PS1 games. The only reason the PSP could is because the PSP's CPU is compatible with that on the PS1 (PS1 is a R3000A while the PSP is a R4000) which means no CPU emulation is required. With the Vita, that is not the case (and if you have ever tried to run a virtualizer like VMware under an actual CPU emulator like QEMU you would know that it doesn't work very well).
     
  10. spyro3dsguy
    OP

    spyro3dsguy GBAtemp Fan

    Member
    304
    62
    Nov 28, 2011
    Canada
    I know you cant combine the two cpu's but can't you map certain things like sound to different processors
     
  11. Buleste

    Buleste Old Fart

    Member
    852
    27
    Dec 19, 2010
    Like I said before Learn how to programme and then start your own DSi Playstation Emulator then you will realise how daft an idea you've had.
     
  12. the_randomizer

    the_randomizer The Temp's official fox whisperer

    Member
    21,192
    10,074
    Apr 29, 2011
    United States
    Dr. Wahwee's castle
    *Sigh* http://en.wikipedia..../Megahertz_myth

    DSi, uses ARM7 @66MHz and the ARM9 @133MHz (ARM architecture)
    PS1, uses MIPS R3000A @33.86MHz (MIPS architecture)
    Dreamcast, uses MIPS Hitachi SH4 @ 200MHz (MIPS architecture)

    GPU power:

    DS/DSi - 150,000 polygons/sec with 656KB of VRAM, 512KB texture memory (max. res - 256x192)
    PSX - 360,000 polygons/sec (180,000 w/lighting and texture mapping), 1MB of VRAM (Res - 256x224 to 640x480)
    Dreamcast - 7,000,000 polygons/sec, 8MB VRAM, (max res - 640x480)

    Based of these specifications, both Dreamcast and PS1's CPUs use the MIPS architecture, there's a huge advantage right there.

    Surprisingly, the DSi and PSX have similar polygonal power, similar amount of system RAM, etc. But there is one factor that would make programming a PS1 emulator a living Hell; converting code from MIPS architecture to ARM architecture. Granted, while it could be done, there is a major issue, and that is emulators work by emulating a console's hardware through software, requiring several times the console's original clock speed. Snes? Requires 800MHz for decent speed. N64, over 1.2GHz. PS2? Dual or quad core CPUs are required. Why? Not because of bad programming, but because different CPU architectures need to be converted to usable code. ARM to MIPS, MIPS to x86, and so on. You want to try making a playable PS1 emulator for the DSi? Good luck.
     
  13. iSubaru

    iSubaru Kitsune

    Member
    360
    18
    Apr 14, 2009
    Poland
    Gensokyo
    Let's take a look for PS1 emulator for iPhone 3G and we have answers
     
  14. YayMii

    YayMii hi

    Member
    4,915
    423
    Jun 24, 2009
    Canada
    that place
    My i7 1.8GHz is better than a Pentium 4 3.8GHz. Meaning that Hz is not a measurement of power. Besides, the DSi has less hardware than the Dreamcast.
     
  15. WatchGintama

    WatchGintama GBAtemp Maniac

    Member
    1,034
    376
    Feb 22, 2009
    United States
    The iSmart MM had a PSX emulator working.
    http://gbatemp.net/topic/301359-ismart-mm-linux-beta-12/page__view__findpost__p__3774002

    -shrugs-
     
  16. Hielkenator

    Hielkenator GBAtemp Psycho!

    Member
    4,219
    385
    Feb 7, 2010
    Netherlands
    Remember that the hardware spec only aplly to EMULATING the PS1.
    In other words : the whole system has to be converted in software, then maybe some hardware of the system could be used to produce graphics on a native hardware level.
    Otherwise it's ALL software.

    And I'm not even talking about running games. Only making a software version of the PS1 able to run on a DSi would be a major achievement.
    It's not as simple as : look at teh harware! Why can't it run on this and that?

    Emulating systems on an other system is ADVANCED stuff.
    it takes a lot of time and effort to get something decent to work.
     
  17. Buleste

    Buleste Old Fart

    Member
    852
    27
    Dec 19, 2010
    The iSMM has a Playstation emulator barely working. The games certainly aren't playable. However it's only possible because of the iSMM's extra CPU and memory.
     
  18. jurassicplayer

    jurassicplayer Completionist Themer

    Member
    4,355
    505
    Mar 7, 2009
    United States
    Pantsuland
    :3 It's playable...it's just...you have to be patient OR play fighting games (and get perfect because you have superb reactions to your opponent).
     
  19. the_randomizer

    the_randomizer The Temp's official fox whisperer

    Member
    21,192
    10,074
    Apr 29, 2011
    United States
    Dr. Wahwee's castle
    Take a look at the Snes emulators written for the DS, like SnemulDS; it can run most games fairly well, but it has to sacrifice a lot in order to do so. Sound glitches, missing background layers, sprite layers, etc because the DS' hardware isn't powerful enough. However, with the Supercard DSTWO flash card (which has a built in CPU), you can take a lot of the DS' CPU, RAM, and so on. With this powerful card, people have now make an Snes emulator with more than acceptable speeds and not be as buggy as SnemulDS (this one being called CATSFC)..
     
  20. spyro3dsguy
    OP

    spyro3dsguy GBAtemp Fan

    Member
    304
    62
    Nov 28, 2011
    Canada
    Ok so what about 3do? It shouldn't require emulation because it runs an older arm cpu (arm60) the same way psp run ps1 and n64 through an e-boot instead of emulation, plus 3do is vastly inferior to the ds. Also n-gage runs the same arm9E chip as the ds as well as pretty much the same hardware ( again said to be slightly inferior to the ds)?