Graf_Chokolo Needs Support or He's Going to Jail

[cwstjdenobs]

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

No he hasn't, not until a court decides he has. What aren't you getting about the idea that this case would have set precedent?

 

[Assax]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

You broke the device, thats all, Nintendo basically just says they don't take responsibility, nothing more than a broken 3DS is going to happen to you, that is in no relation to Graf's case.

 

[Magmorph]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

What law did he break?

 

[firetempest]

I'd really love to ask these hackers that have been caught why they didn't take simple steps so they wouldn't get caught. Why they didn't mask their ip address, and release under an alias. It doesn't take a smart guy to figure out that Sony is going to come down on you like a ton of bricks with a fleet of lawyers. It just seems to me that these brilliant hackers have very little in the way of common sense.

 

[omgpwn666]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

What law did he break?

I will assume you're kidding.

And here is the bottom line, I believe in the law, you guys don't. Now lets stop making a stupid war over differing opinions. You guys looked into your opinions, and so did I. We all know debating with each other is not gonna change any opinions. We're all probably closed minded, judging by all the comments I've read.

 

[FluffyLunamoth]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

When did Nintendo start making laws? When did breaking something equal a law broken? Even better: When did Nintendo make laws stating that if it's ONLY breaking a law if the device breaks?

EDIT: Yeah, you're either a really...bad troll...or a little kid who's REALLY blind to how the world runs. Can't even back up your statements with proof when cornered. I feel bad for anyone who gets put on trial with you on the jury.

 

[Magmorph]

I will assume you're kidding.

And here is the bottom line, I believe in the law, you guys don't. Now lets stop making a stupid war over differing opinions. You guys looked into your opinions, and so did I. We all know debating with each other is not gonna change any opinions. We're all probably closed minded, judging by all the comments I've read.

No, I'm not kidding. Can you actually demonstrate that he broke a law?

 

[omgpwn666]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

When did Nintendo start making laws? When did breaking something equal a law broken? Even better: When did Nintendo make laws stating that if it's ONLY breaking a law if the device breaks?

EDIT: Yeah, you're either a really...bad troll...or a little kid who's REALLY blind to how the world runs. Can't even back up your statements with proof when cornered. I feel bad for anyone who gets put on trial with you on the jury.

Seems you're talking about yourself... It's easy for me to have proof of everything I say, the law backs up what I'm saying. You're just against it. You can choose not to like a law, you can't change it. Now stop being immature.

 

[redact]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

What law did he break?

I will assume you're kidding.

he's not. state exactly which law was broken and go into detail about it, please

 

[Assax]

It's easy for me to have proof of everything I say, the law backs up what I'm saying.

You made me laugh before going to bed, thanks

 

[FluffyLunamoth]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.

When did Nintendo start making laws? When did breaking something equal a law broken? Even better: When did Nintendo make laws stating that if it's ONLY breaking a law if the device breaks?

EDIT: Yeah, you're either a really...bad troll...or a little kid who's REALLY blind to how the world runs. Can't even back up your statements with proof when cornered. I feel bad for anyone who gets put on trial with you on the jury.

Seems you're talking about yourself... It's easy for me to have proof of everything I say, the law backs up what I'm saying. You're just against it. You can choose not to like a law, you can't change it. Now stop being immature.

I will accept that, and apologize personally, as soon as you prove which law he broke.

 

[Magmorph]

Seems you're talking about yourself... It's easy for me to have proof of everything I say, the law backs up what I'm saying. You're just against it. You can choose not to like a law, you can't change it. Now stop being immature.

If everyone had that mentality we would never have abolished slavery. Slavery was perfectly legal. Why should the people have questioned a law?

 

[omgpwn666]

Seems you're talking about yourself... It's easy for me to have proof of everything I say, the law backs up what I'm saying. You're just against it. You can choose not to like a law, you can't change it. Now stop being immature.

If everyone had that mentality we would never have abolished slavery. Slavery was perfectly legal. Why should the people have questioned a law?

Now this is what I like to read, very good point. Even though at the time it was legal to have a slave, so anyone with a slave does not deserve to get in trouble through the laws eyes. And why is everyone asking me what law he broke? I could have sworn they said it in the source. He reverse engineered right? I'm guessing that's what it's called, not exactly sure. And Assax, glad I could make you laugh, if you want to laugh more you should Google laws. lol

 

[Assax]

Now this is what I like to read, very good point. Even though at the time it was legal to have a slave, so anyone with a slave does not deserve to get in trouble through the laws eyes. And why is everyone asking me what law he broke? I could have sworn they said it in the source. He reverse engineered right? I'm guessing that's what it's called, not exactly sure. And Assax, glad I could make you laugh, if you want to laugh more you should Google laws. lol

Everyone is asking about the law he broke because you are always saying that you can backup your position with law while you have not provided any reference to any law that applies here.

Wikipedia:

Sec. 103(f) of the DMCA (17 U.S.C. § 1201 (f)) says that if you legally obtain a program that is protected, you are allowed to reverse-engineer and circumvent the protection to achieve the ability the interoperability of computer programs (i.e., the ability to exchange and make use of information)

This is for the US but since Graf lives in Germany:
QUOTE

Article 6 of the 1991 EU Computer Programs Directive allows reverse engineering for the purposes of interoperability, but prohibits it for the purposes of creating a competing product, and also prohibits the public release of information obtained through reverse engineering of software.

So, all he made himself guilty of was releasing his bible AFTER his first raid, until his first raid he did not release any "public information obtained through reverse engineering" as far as I remember.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[omgpwn666]

So, all he made himself guilty of was releasing his bible AFTER his first raid, until his first raid he did not release any "public information obtained through reverse engineering" as far as I remember.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

Okay, I guess that's the law he broke. So my point still stands, he broke a law and I think he should pay for it. Unless of course, he is not guilty. Remember I'm talking through the laws eyes, not personal opinions. Just because someone does not like a law does not mean the law is no longer valid.

Edit : Okay, and some opinion.. I don't really like people who rebel that hugely against the law.

 

[Assax]

Edit : Okay, and some opinion.. I don't really like people who rebel that hugely against the law.

It's the democratic citizen's duty to participate in the forming of the state, demonstrate and raise doubts when something seems wrong.
Also Sony raided him b4 he "broke this law", anyway I'm out of here.

 

[omgpwn666]

Edit : Okay, and some opinion.. I don't really like people who rebel that hugely against the law.

It's the democratic citizen's duty to participate in the forming of the state, demonstrate and raise doubts when something seems wrong.
Also Sony raided him b4 he "broke this law", anyway I'm out of here.

That's not bad for me, if Sony broke a law they should both be in trouble. As simple as that. But thanks for keeping things legit and mature.

 

[Magmorph]

Edit : Okay, and some opinion.. I don't really like people who rebel that hugely against the law.

It's the democratic citizen's duty to participate in the forming of the state, demonstrate and raise doubts when something seems wrong.
Also Sony raided him b4 he "broke this law", anyway I'm out of here.

That's not bad for me, if Sony broke a law they should both be in trouble. As simple as that. But thanks for keeping things legit and mature.

You will find that having oodles of money puts you at a significant advantage in any legal system.

 

[omgpwn666]

Edit : Okay, and some opinion.. I don't really like people who rebel that hugely against the law.

It's the democratic citizen's duty to participate in the forming of the state, demonstrate and raise doubts when something seems wrong.
Also Sony raided him b4 he "broke this law", anyway I'm out of here.

That's not bad for me, if Sony broke a law they should both be in trouble. As simple as that. But thanks for keeping things legit and mature.

You will find that having oodles of money puts you at a significant advantage in any legal system.

Didn't Sony raid him after he released his reversed engineered tech? If not, you're right though, some people can buy there way through the legal system, but I would just call it paying fines.

 

[Assax]

Didn't Sony raid him after he released his reversed engineered tech? If not, you're right though, some people can buy there way through the legal system, but I would just call it paying fines.

They raided him twice, before he released it, then out of revenge he did so even though they took away all his hardware, then some months afterwards they did so again.
Also, releasing his own tech doesn't break the law, what did break it was the information about Sony's software/hardware structure he released with the bible, not his selfmade OtherOs support.

QUOTEbut I would just call it paying fines

Shouldn't have said this, really, you shouldn't