Graf_Chokolo Needs Support or He's Going to Jail

[redact]

He did do something wrong, he knows it, Sony knows it, and we do. It's not a secret that he did something illegal. I don't even think he denies bringing Linux to PS3.

you're trolling me, right?
since when the fuck is using an open source SDK (psl1ght) to port an open source Operating System (Linux) to your own paid-for hardware considered a crime?
if you want your rights quashed then good for you but i don't want sony to rule my life or graf's life :/

 

[FluffyLunamoth]

Well, he did something illegal, I guess he should pay for it. I wouldn't donate, but someone else will.

And what is this illegal thing you speak of? Bringing linux back to PS3? Reverse-engineering?

Yeah, sure. I don't see what you're getting at, they would not fine someone for not breaking the law.

So you have complete trust in the legal system? Do not question anything they do? Just because someone is taken to court they're automatically in the wrong?

I believe in the legal system, and also... He did do something wrong, he knows it, Sony knows it, and we do. It's not a secret that he did something illegal. I don't even think he denies bringing Linux to PS3.

You believe in the legal system? Wow, you poor, poor man. Really should read up on a lot of the stuff that goes on. Anyway, when did hacking your property become illegal? Because Sony says not to?

Yeah, yeah. I look down on you for not believing in the legal system. I see lots of things where guilty people are guilty, and innocent people are innocent. And am I supposed to think, "He is guilty, that must mean he is innocent" and vice versa? And if an official company says not to mess with something, don't do it.

Judging by that answer, I truly think you're trolling everyone. If not, you're blind.

8/10 Trolling. Good, but too easy to spot.

 

[cwstjdenobs]

This world would suck if they could bend laws to others liking. Could you imagine a world where everything you do is okay? He broke a real law that should not be changed because it's Sony's system, it's their rules. They said not to do something, don't do it, as simple as that. I break laws, and if I get caught I have to pay for the consequences.

The whole point of the case is to see if what he did is illegal. The EUCD does allow for reversing for interoperability, which could (I personally believe should) include running Linux. The case needs to be heard to set precedent and decide how the directive should be enforced and how much scope it has. For someone so on the side of the law you don't seem to understand much about it.

 

[Assax]

Yeah, yeah. I look down on you for not believing in the legal system. I see lots of things where guilty people are guilty, and innocent people are innocent. And am I supposed to think, "He is guilty, that must mean he is innocent" and vice versa? And if an official company says not to mess with something, don't do it.

That's not even the point, opinions will always be different, it's just that only because laws say so one does not have to blindly agree with them.
Use your reason in order to think about whether something is really that bad that it should be illegal.
If you still think what graf has done is really enough to jail him and sue him for millions, okay then.

 

[MEGAMANTROTSKY]

...it's Sony's system, it's their rules...

Because rules which were set down by a corporate entity with a history of end-user abuse should be uncritically swallowed? Please.

 

[omgpwn666]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

 

[FluffyLunamoth]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Actually, no. Your logic is broken. "Why can't I do this? No law says I can't." is more what it is. The law is corrupt, and if you fail to realize that, then...well...you're just blind.

For the record, I'm no hacker. Nor even a pirate, in most cases. Your logic is just blind optimism that the law isn't controlled by whoever has the most money at the time.

 

[cwstjdenobs]

Not true, if it was Sony could not sue anyone.

You do know suing someone is civil and not criminal law yes?

Actually anyone with enough money can sue anyone for anything. Then these things are meant to be decided in court. The defendant could be found in breach and punished, the plaintiffs could also be given a load of shit and a fine for wasting the courts time.

 

[Assax]

This reminds me so much of this youtube troll video I saw which posed the question:
"If god does not exist, then who wrote the bible?"

No offense to religious people though!

 

[omgpwn666]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Actually, no. Your logic is broken. "Why can't I do this? No law says I can't." is more what it is. The law is corrupt, and if you fail to realize that, then...well...you're just blind.

Laws are made for reasons. People where actually not updating because they want to keep Linux, that could cause some security risks or any other problems the patch could've been meant to fix. They don't make laws to say lol they can't do this now, they do it because it has a reason. Don't break laws and everything should work fine. If I break my 3DS using my Acekard it's my fault.

 

[Assax]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Actually, no. Your logic is broken. "Why can't I do this? No law says I can't." is more what it is. The law is corrupt, and if you fail to realize that, then...well...you're just blind.

Laws are made for reasons. People where actually not updating because they want to keep Linux, that could cause some security risks or any other problems the patch could've been meant to fix. They don't make laws to say lol they can't do this now, they do it because it has a reason. Don't break laws and everything should work fine. If I break my 3DS using my Acekard it's my fault.

You know that, at least in Europe, that bricking the Nintendo 3DS because a consumer has used flashcards (which are perfectly legal btw) is illegal for Nintendo?
Again, laws were made by people, people have flaws, laws have flaws.

 

[FluffyLunamoth]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Actually, no. Your logic is broken. "Why can't I do this? No law says I can't." is more what it is. The law is corrupt, and if you fail to realize that, then...well...you're just blind.

Laws are made for reasons. People where actually not updating because they want to keep Linux, that could cause some security risks or any other problems the patch could've been meant to fix. They don't make laws to say lol they can't do this now, they do it because it has a reason. Don't break laws and everything should work fine. If I break my 3DS using my Acekard it's my fault.

This is my last reply to you, as it's going nowhere. Them not updating? Guess what. Their property. Their choice. The updates are not mandatory. The ONLY reason they are on the discs is because each firmware is made to fix, add, or remove something. Something the game may not be able to handle. There is NO law stating you can't do what you want with your property. Why do you think Apple lost the lawsuit over jailbreaking?

 

[MEGAMANTROTSKY]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Your "logic", if one could call it that, involves taking the side of a company that does not really deserve to be defended when their complete history with their customers is taken into account. In this case, you're a bourgeois apologist whose practice of "using the law" does not go beyond the will of Howard Stringer and his big shareholder cronies. Shamefully, even Lulzsec appears more favorable than you right now.

 

[omgpwn666]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Actually, no. Your logic is broken. "Why can't I do this? No law says I can't." is more what it is. The law is corrupt, and if you fail to realize that, then...well...you're just blind.


Laws are made for reasons. People where actually not updating because they want to keep Linux, that could cause some security risks or any other problems the patch could've been meant to fix. They don't make laws to say lol they can't do this now, they do it because it has a reason. Don't break laws and everything should work fine. If I break my 3DS using my Acekard it's my fault.

You know that, at least in Europe, that bricking the Nintendo 3DS because a consumer has used flashcards (which are perfectly legal btw) is illegal for Nintendo?
Again, laws were made by people, people have flaws, laws have flaws.

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

QUOTE

Your "logic", if one could call it that, involves taking the side of a company that does not really deserve to be defended when their complete history with their customers is taken into account. In this case, you're a bourgeois apologist whose practice of "using the law" does not go beyond the will of Howard Stringer and his big shareholder cronies. Shamefully, even Lulzsec appears more favorable than you right now.

That was not too smart to say. That's your opinion that a company does not need to be listened to because they did a "bad" job. I assume you meant bad since you're talking about Sony, the people who got hacked.

 

[stanleyopar2000]

corrupt and fascist legal system

 

[Assax]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.
Your "logic", if one could call it that, involves taking the side of a company that does not really deserve to be defended when their complete history with their customers is taken into account. In this case, you're a bourgeois apologist whose practice of "using the law" does not go beyond the will of Howard Stringer and his big shareholder cronies. Shamefully, even Lulzsec appears more favorable than you right now.


Actually their released doc for the 1000st tweet makes Lulzsec sound pretty serious and reasonable.
Yeah they are kinda dumb, at least when it comes to overthinking the outcome of their actions for themselves but they state some pretty good points.

QUOTE

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

 

[m3rox]

What can I say, you're all hackers and law breakers, of course you would not agree with me. I'm on the laws side, which I guess makes me a troll. My logic is using the law, yours is "Why can't I do this? Because they say not to?"... That would never stand in court.

Your "logic", if one could call it that, involves taking the side of a company that does not really deserve to be defended when their complete history with their customers is taken into account. In this case, you're a bourgeois apologist whose practice of "using the law" does not go beyond the will of Howard Stringer and his big shareholder cronies. Shamefully, even Lulzsec appears more favorable than you right now. Enjoy teething the recent merit badge you acquired in "being a stooge".

Lol, someone has a 'word-of-the-day' calendar

 

[MEGAMANTROTSKY]

Actually their released doc for the 1000st tweet makes Lulzsec sound pretty serious and reasonable.
Yeah they are kinda dumb, at least when it comes to overthinking the outcome of their actions for themselves but they state some pretty good points.

Honestly, I don't know what to think of Lulzsec yet. In the meantime, I think a complete defense of their actions is impossible, mature or not.

@m3rox: I promise that there's no calendar. Just doctrinaire literature professors.

@Assax: (reply to the post ahead of my own) Agreed.
@stanleyopar2000: While we should probably discuss this in another thread, I think your assessment is premature. It cannot be said that the US state has embraced fascism yet.

 

[Assax]

Actually their released doc for the 1000st tweet makes Lulzsec sound pretty serious and reasonable.
Yeah they are kinda dumb, at least when it comes to overthinking the outcome of their actions for themselves but they state some pretty good points.

Honestly, I don't know what to think of Lulzsec. In the meantime, I think a complete defense of their actions is impossible, mature or not.

I agree, complete defense makes no sense as releasing user passwords and names etc is really against any reason.
However it's good that they kinda point out how full of flaws the internet is just as they say.

But let's not discuss this here, it will derail the whole thread.

 

[omgpwn666]

I was actually talking about my own faults, not Nintendo. Like doing something dumb, like trying a homebrew game that is supposed to do something neat and it bricks my system. Not sure if it's possible, just an example.

True, it is, but that has nothing to do with the legal side of things at all.
Nobody can sue you for using homebrew things, you cannot sue anyone as you were aware it might brick your system due to faulty code.
I don't get the connection with our case to be honest.

Because Nintendo says not to use flashcarts, even if they're legal, and I used it and my DS breaks, it's my fault. Same reason this guy is at fault, he broke a law.