Got an old 360, repairs needed. Advice?

Discussion in 'Xbox 360 - Games & Content' started by Devil May Cry, Dec 18, 2010.

Dec 18, 2010
  1. Devil May Cry
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    Member Devil May Cry GBAtemp Fan

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    So thanks to a friend, I'm now the owner of an Xbox 360. I'm new to the 360 scene, so I don't really know the model of it (although it's not an S model, Elite, or presumably an Arcade). It mentions the Kinect on the dash, so I'm guessing its beyond JTAG (which is what I was hoping for). I want to get this thing reading some burned DL-DVDs ASAP, but the thing is that the darned thing won't read discs. i doesn't even register the disc in the slightest, 360 games or DVDs. Now, there are some things I'd like some help with regarding how I start about this.


    Should I follow a dissassembly guide until the disc drive (to find out the model) and order a replacement drive? From what I've seen online, I can ever either flash the new drive or swap the logic boards between the drives. Which option should I take? After getting the drive to read discs, can someone suggest a solid guide for what I need to do to properly mod a 360, as well as getting a rig set up to rip 360 games (which I heard needs a special DVD drive)?

    Any and all help would be appreciated.



    P.S. If you read this FAST, please be link easy on me [​IMG]
     
  2. FAST6191

    Reporter FAST6191 Techromancer

    pip
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    If it has kinect on the dash it is way past JTAG. Still https://docs.google.com/View?id=dnfmv5h_30dw33vpf4 will tell you if you can JTAG it or not.

    Burned DVDs- if the DVD drive is not taking discs that is not ideal (if it "works" until then that is a good sign) but moving forward. Yes pull the thing apart and find model numbers as they will be key in a few minutes.
    360 drives are tied to the 360 they came from (it is about the only thing stopping 360s being truly easy to hack) by way of an onboard serial number (which is stored in writeable memory). Likewise this memory contains a firmware which technically controls what discs run (you can not edit the code though as that is another layer of security which JTAG takes care of) and this firmware is what we hack to flash a DVD drive.
    Methods for flashing DVD drives vary between models and can get quite elaborate but http://www.jungleflasher.net/downloads.html has a nice guide to it all. If it is older chances are it will be simpler to do.
    With the current dashboards (before you could spoof it but not any more) you will need the same DVD model (firmware excepted- nothing different between a 9 series liteon and a 7 series liteon*). As a consequence replacement drives will likely cost you a bit unless you can scrounge one from a RRoD console or something.
    I would be tempted to try a PCB swap (not the laser assembly or anything beyond the basic PCB though- properly calibrating/aligning such things is not something you want to be doing) but if you have the same model and you are flashing it to a hacked firmware anyway there is little point.
    You dump the firmware of the dead 360 drive (assuming it powers you should be able to grab it), grab the serial numbers, barcodes and whatever else and use them to build a new hacked firmware. Flash this hacked firmware to the new 360 drive and stick it in the 360. Job done- the DVD should be working and you can play copied games.

    *if in doubt look at the hacked firmwares. If there is just one called samsung LT as opposed to a whole bunch of slightly different ones aimed at different models then that will probably change things although if someone could elaborate on whether hitachi models are same hardware, noticeably different firmware with all that it implies that would be great.



    Ripping 360 games- I can not make this simple and walk away knowing I did my "job", it is "simple" but equally it is "simple" to screw up as many a P2P group (and even scene groups when in a rush) have been all too happy to demonstrate over the years. There is something of a difference between "having it work" and "not having it so detectable it is not funny".

    Not that many people do it nowadays for reasons I will elaborate on at the end. You could originally use specially hacked PC DVD drives (usually called kreon drives) but they have fallen out of favour as they can not rip the newer versions of the security sectors properly (you can still patch them in though using ABGX360 http://abgx360.net/ ) and simple hacked 360 DVD drives can do the job just as well.
    For the hacked 360 DVD approach you need an 0800 hacked firmware (no need for serial numbers- just flash it). For a while it was built into the hacked firmwares but LT (the current "line") dropped it to help remain undetectable.
    These 0800 drives can not dump the newest of the new security sectors either although they can do more than the hacked PC drives (they probably can dump the newer sectors but the methods are being held back for now). Much like the above you can use ABGX360 to patch in things though.

    Once you have the hardware grab Xbox backup Creator and use that (have a quick scan through the help file). Provided you use ABGX360 to test your rips the only thing you really have to watch out for is SSv3 mentioned below (although ABGX360 should tell you that too) and that you do not have anydvd or something like that running in the background- it messes up the video partitions of the iso (the simple little video that plays when you put a 360 game in a DVD player and these days the dashboard updates) and MS can detect this.

    A quick aside- there are 4 versions of security sectors
    SSv1 kreon
    SSv1 0800
    SSv2 0800 1.6 (I think) or newer.
    SSv3 - AP2.5 workaround.

    Kreon only does SSV1 which is fine for older games, newer games are not advised to use SSv1 kreon and AP2.5 does not work without a JTAG.
    SSv1 0800 is the same as SSV2 but can not be told apart from SSV1 kreon. Likewise AP2.5 games can not be dumped/use them.
    SSv2 0800 was added in one of the later ixtreme firmwares. Functionally it is the same as SSV1 0800 but given some unknown sectors you can say "yes that is SSv2".
    SSv3 was made in response to the recent AP2.5 stuff. It contains the relevant data help with the bypass of AP2.5

    Just quickly- MS added a new protection in the last round of kinect dash betas that allows them to detect some drives as being flashed by way of code. Fable 3, Assassins Creed Brotherhood and Need 4 Speed hot pursuit are the only three games to employ it thus far (well more like 20 once you account for region dupes). Not all drives can do AP25 (samsung and some of the hitachi drives are immune) and those drives that can do AP2.5 simply have to patch the iso to use SSV3 and upgrade to the LT+ hacked firmware to bypass it.

    Frankly speaking and granted I have unlimited usenet and a half decent ISP/connection but I would think long and hard before setting up to rip 360 games. There is a lot of potential aggro which is easily avoided.
     
  3. Devil May Cry
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    Member Devil May Cry GBAtemp Fan

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    Only 3 links, not too bad FAST [​IMG]

    When it comes to security protection, I have absolutely no interest in getting this 360 online in the slightest. So it really is just a matter of finding a ripper/burner that is simple to use and supports a large amount of the 360's titles. As for the repairs or it, I'm not sure if I'm getting precisely what you're saying regarding the replacement drive. Are you saying since I'm on a fairly recent firmware (which I'll get and add-on to this thread ASAP), I must get a replacement drive that is the same model (i.e. Samsung, Hitachi, etc), but the series itself doesn't matter (I mean, as long as it the same sort of drive, I don't necessarily mean trying to get a laptop hard drive in there or something).

    As for the PCB swap, I just heard that it was a potentially safer way to fix a drive, since a flash could go bad. Thinking back on it though, a flash problem would most likely be user error and I have some experience when it comes to flashing tech.

    Lastly, got two more questions regarding the drive:

    1. Is there anything you can think of that might be preventing the drive from working that doesn't require a swap? I mean something along the lines of like, say, a dirty lens (which the previous owner said wasn't the case, but I'll most likely try it myself anyways). Or possibly a part getting loose?

    2. A pure hypothetical here, but let's say once I try powering the drive to get to the firmware it doesn't power on. Now what?


    EDIT: As I'm new to the scene, I'm not really sure what AP25 is. I'm guessing some sort of anti-piracy that hasn't been fully cracked yet.
     
  4. FAST6191

    Reporter FAST6191 Techromancer

    pip
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    Dirty lens/underpowered laser (they get worse over time) could be what you are seeing, you can try a POT tweak but as for simple "switches, capacitors and power supply" type checks I know of none that are not caused by people not hacking things properly. POT tweak http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=517961
    Similarly most usually only opt for pot tweaks when they have "dirty disc" type errors for spotless discs not completely unable to read and even then it is something of a last ditch/hold me over until payday type method.

    Yeah a PCB swap is likely safer but as you would be flashing a drive anyway (not to mention have the original PCB in reserve) and only the hitachis can be bricked during flashing (everything else you just try again) I did not see the need.

    MS just updated the dashboard to check the original model of drive is sitting there (originally you could spoof different drives all you like), if you want to play the latest games you need the latest dashboard (there is no chance of swapping between older and newer either). If you look at http://abgx360.net/verified.php any wave above and including 8 will need the latest dash (before you ask Fable 3 was the exception- it was wave 6 but has a weird version of AP25 compared to the others). The only way around this is to update the keyvault to match the drive but you need the CPU key for that and if you have that in your situation you can have a JTAG machine on your hands.

    AP25- it is fully cracked/worked around but older hacked firmwares do not support it. As it needs more data from an iso that also meant a new revision of security sectors needed to be made which were dubbed SSv3. All the older games (seemingly including those with title updates) work fine with SSv2. Likewise JTAG machines have several bypass methods as well. AP25 is not a matter of being banned- the games will straight up not work (a different approach from everything MS did in the past).
    All 360 titles can be ripped using any drive- it is just security sectors that will trouble you. As mentioned though ABGX360 has got you covered and stealth sectors are perhaps a few megabytes at most.

    For the hypothetical (assuming you do not have the CPU key) if it is going to be done at all it will take electrical skills- you are going to have the read the flash out manually and grab the keys from that dump. Equally I am sure we have all had flash memory fall over on us so if that is gone there is no hope.
    If you do not have the key you are limited to games on demand and if you replace the drive then dvd videos as well.
     
  5. Devil May Cry
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    Member Devil May Cry GBAtemp Fan

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    - Good point on the flashing, didn't occur to me that I'd be flashing either way regardless of repairs [​IMG]

    - I'll give the POT tweak a try, although it doesn't seem like it'll help me in my case.

    - So, I'll need the newest dash. Alright, as long as this is possible with a modded drive, I'm down. Like I said earlier, online isn't an issue for me. I really just want to play 360 exclusives on this, offline only. If I'm not JTAG, is there still a way to install DLC add-ons (figure some games might have some single player add-ons, a la Fallout 3 [except no GOTY version]).

    - The way you're speaking about JTAG makes it sound like there is faint chance I could have it. I thought having a recent dash prevented this?

    - Okay, AP25 makes a bit more sense now. Most games I'm interested in are fairly old, so hopefully it won't be too big a concern for me.

    -Since I'll be using zero online on the 360, do I have to bother with proper security sectors and stealth? I know I need a proper rip, but do I need a safe one?

    - If I don't have the key and I'm beyond JTAG, how would I still have modded access to GOD? I thought that was JTAG exclusive stuff.


    Sorry if these are some fairly easy questions, I'm still in the "n00b" phase when it comes to 360.
     
  6. FAST6191

    Reporter FAST6191 Techromancer

    pip
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    DLC- there is the profile sharing thing but need live at least once.
    Your main options at this point are GOTY stuff (it sometimes comes in a form of container known as PIRS* which you can just copy to the hard drive/maybe 360 style USB drive along with the relevant title updates and it will work) and maybe some of the LIVE2CON stuff (normal DLC comes in LIVE containers- it was found you can bodge some of the smaller stuff (mainly music game DLC) into CON format and have it work, I have not really investigated that much though.

    *DLC comes in one of three main methods- standalone game (GTA lost and damned), as an installer (borderlands double pack- not GOTY though, some mass effect stuff and several more- I posted a list somewhere around here) and lastly as a download code (sadly a lot of games- RE5 gold, most gears of war stuff, borderlands GOTY and beyond). edit found a thread with a list, there might be some more by now though http://gbatemp.net/t257712-dlc-xbla-on-non...t&p=3166819

    -Proper stealth, it is easy enough to do and you never know what MS will do in the future either so you might as well. Stealth sectors are important though.
    I did not want to get into this but IF AP25 does not take off and it remains as those three games or you have an AP25 incapable drive then you might consider 1.6NS as your hacked firmware of choice- it has the fewest restrictions of any hacked firmware (LT has the need for splitvid although if you are building your own isos then that is simple enough to work around).

    JTAG- sorry about confusing things, if you have updated since August 11th 2009 (or your 360 was made after mid June 2009) then no JTAG. The guides I linked cover quick and simple tests that need no hardware.

    GOD- it stands for games on demand but it is mostly JTAG users that abuse the format to run games simply as it is a minor tweak on what happens when you install to the hard drive, you download them like you would XBLA from xbox live. Although if you are skipping live then no chance of that.
     
  7. Devil May Cry
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    Member Devil May Cry GBAtemp Fan

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    Alright, I think I'm good for now. I'll try cracking open the 360 and seeing what drive I have. I'll add a post once I do.
     

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