1. KleinesSinchen

    OP KleinesSinchen GBAtemp's Backup Reminder + Fearless Testing Sina
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    I’ve been repeatedly been disappointed by various people who I deemed good friends at some point (and made the mistake of trusting them). Sooner or later it turned out that people were taking advantage of me. In the beginning it’s a give-and-take basis and all good. Then it gradually shifts to→ One side gives and the other takes… and when I’ve had enough and tell about my feelings, I get something like this: “Not true. Your fault, Sinchen. You’re wrong, we’re right kthx. End of discussion. Bye bye!”

    It seems inevitable; It seems to be a question of when will “friends” start treating me like a piece of sh.. – not a question if they will do it. My impression is that people do not want me as a person. They want my work performance, my skills… and my generosity in material things (I don’t care much for money and happily share and give away things that money can buy).

    The general questions:
    ===============
    • Do you think it is possible to find reliable friends? Or are humans just too selfish to be reliable and true friends in the long run? Or is demanding a give-and-take basis for deeper social interaction a too high standard?
    • Have you ever experienced something like this (friends turning out to be opportunistic, bossy egoists knowing no self-criticism at all)?
    • Any ideas how to avoid relationships like this (early warning signs)?
    • Any ideas how to deal with people like this?
    ===============

    Since there are a lot of smart people on GBAtemp: Why not ask here?

    I would be grateful for any comments or opinions.

    KleinesSinchen
     
  2. spotanjo3

    spotanjo3 GBAtemp Legend
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    Yes, there are rare people out there. I had one when we were childhood in school and it didn't work out very good when we are into an adulthood.

    To your several questions.. Its depends. Not everyone are the same boat. The advice sometimes doesn't work that way. Only you and you alone have to judge from the point of view. Everybody are totally different.

    Anyway, I have many friends but not what I am looking for. I was desperately a friendship and trustworthy... So I search and somehow I found one. And we became bestest friends and trusted. Now, we are roommate for 20 years.

    No problem at all. We share everything even his own life and his own space as well as I do. Yes, there are good people out there. You just have to find someone like a needle in the hay.

    Dont give up.
     
    Last edited by spotanjo3, Dec 9, 2020
  3. IC_

    IC_ Go Vegan
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    I have experienced this many times, I don't know if it's actually possible to find good people in this world, most humans are indeed too selfish and stupid from my experience...
     
  4. Flofflewoffle

    Flofflewoffle GBAtemp Advanced Fan
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    I'm sorry about what happened to you @KleinesSinchen :'c

    But I do think good friends exist :3 That its entirely impossible I would not believe. I can't say why you end up being deceived though while others may have been in good harmony with each other ;w; but when it happens to you it makes it feel like those are the rules in general. So it has happened to me, but with other things.

    What does a give-and-take basis for deeper social interaction actually mean though?
     
  5. onibaku

    onibaku Lurker
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    I've made a lot of good friends in my childhood but we've all moved to different countries. I haven't seen some of them in years but we still keep in touch. I have had similar experiences as you where people take easily but cannot give back (and I get those experiences pretty frequently) but I just don't interact with them more than I need to and I don't consider them as my friends. It's hard for me to pinpoint exact warning signs but I'm usually reserved towards meeting and hanging out with new people, I can tell quite quickly whether or not that person is reliable (and so far, I have met very few that are).

    Honestly though, even my childhood friends may not be as reliable as I imagine, I dont know how theyd respond if I got into a tight spot. I never ask people for anything (except for help here on GBAtemp :P) and I hope to never have to rely on others. I also enjoy my own company and don't really have a need for daily (or weekly) interaction with friends.

    There have also been times where I misjudged a person. I knew one guy that I initially thought was a douche but he ended up becoming one of my best friends. He rarely asked for anything and if he did, he would be sure to repay me in some way (even at my refusal to accept any repayment)
     
  6. alexander1970

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    Hello. 1111smiley_emoticons_seb_zylinder.gif

    You maybe know my Answer,but for the Public a maybe "popular" Answer:

    fuck.gif

    I have no time for People,who are wasting my Time.

    Yes,of course,for my "Job Side".
    ......these People are not my Friends.

    BUT it is entirely possible that a Friendship could emerge from it.
    Personal Experience.:)

    NO,absolute no 100 Percent peferct working Idea.

    Very many People today have the great Ability to "hide" their real Face.
    And very often it takes a few Weeks to see their "real" Face(s).Unfortunately very often - too late for yourself.
    And Damage is done...sometimes thank God only little,sometimes...you know....

    This often has maybe to do with Attentiveness and Empathy,to recognize this in good Time before one personally suffers "harm".
    Our Society today is based on this Principle.
    It is applied everywhere and is also used shamelessly.

    Thank you.:)
     
    Last edited by alexander1970, Dec 9, 2020
  7. Chary

    Chary Never sleeps
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    I never made “true” friends until after high school. For a while, I thought people were just selfish as a whole, but if you’re lucky, you can find people who you can trust.

    Ive had strong friendships that run their course and end mutually. Just, people growing apart and no longer sharing interests or life experiences and it fades away amicably. And I’ve also had knock down drag out friendship ending fights because some people try to take too much and try to look down on you and pick on you, because they’re using you and compensating for their own lack of stability in life. Some people only want “friends” to be toxic to.

    There’s not really many early warning signs. Some people just show their true colors earlier than others. I’ve noticed that people who don’t talk equally to each other, say, they talk about all their problems to someone, and then the someone tries to talk about their problems later, only to get ignored or belittled or have the topic quickly changed back to benefit the other.

    If you find people who you think won’t be good friendship material, then really all you have to do is walk away. It’s not fair to yourself to invest time in something you don’t feel will work out. And it’s not fair to the other person either, even if they’re not a good friend. Just walk away.
     
  8. DBlaze

    DBlaze I don't know what i'm doing.
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    Do you think it is possible to find reliable friends?
    Yes.

    Or are humans just too selfish to be reliable and true friends in the long run?
    Everyone has some selfishness to some degree. If you only think the possible worst scenario, you're never going to make (close, good, true, whatever you want to call it) friends. And it's also not something you will just outright ask.

    Or is demanding a give-and-take basis for deeper social interaction a too high standard?
    Demanding ANYTHING from a friendship is too high of a standard. A friendship formed based on demands is not a friendship.

    Have you ever experienced something like this (friends turning out to be opportunistic, bossy egoists knowing no self-criticism at all)?
    Yes, and I cut them off if they don't stop because I'm not their personal assistant. I don't mind helping people at all, but I'm not going to be someone's go-to guy or yes man for every occasion.

    Any ideas how to avoid relationships like this (early warning signs)?
    There is none other then get to know people and don't get "too close" early on. Hang out, do what friends do whatever that is nowadays, for me it's usually just hanging out, talking about nonsense and doing random crap.

    Any ideas how to deal with people like this?
    At some point if they keep asking things from you, tell them no. They will eventually stop and keep hanging out, or they will just disappear from your life.


    On the other side, I don't really expect much from my friends or anyone else for that matter, I like being able to do things by myself. Sure, if I need someone to help lift heavy shit, or obviously anything else I would need help with, I'll ask if anyone that I know could help is available to help, if they can't, so be it, I can always find someone else, my family is pretty much always up for helping but I don't always want to bother them either.
    If someone needs my help with something, I'm up for it, and if I just don't have time or don't feel like it, I will just tell them that I can't.

    The same goes with SOME of my family members, because i'm the "IT guy" of the family, some of them expect me to drop everything and show up to help them the minute they call me. Because sometimes I couldn't, some of them started to complain I was never available, bla bla. The thing was, I never asked them for anything, ever. I didn't need them for anything and that is fine, but if you ignore my advice and keep calling me about the same problem for weeks to fix it, then you can shove it up your hole to be honest :ninja:

    Bossy people are usually easy to spot, I rarely interact with them because I absolutely can not stand them.

    But never ever expect a "give-and-take" basis for anything when dealing with people (other than work, obviously because contract obligations, etc.), there's always an aspect of it in the end, but don't describe it like it's some sort of contract.
     
    Last edited by DBlaze, Dec 9, 2020
  9. DinohScene

    DinohScene hail p1ngpong
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    It's incredibly hard to find but it's there.
    I can speak from experience.
     
  10. Taleweaver

    Taleweaver Storywriter
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    Phew...heavy topic. I'm...not really sure how to start, really. Let's just start and see where it goes...

    First off: the spoiler bit...I'm sorry for your experience, @KleinesSinchen. I really hope you're not giving up, because believe me: actual friendly people are out there. They won't come knocking on your door, but if you find them and give them your friendship, they will respond in kind.

    *sigh* I wish I could elaborate on the "if you find them" part, but I honestly don't know. I've been burned before, and one time very badly...but I've got equally good stories to tell.


    • Do you think it is possible to find reliable friends? Or are humans just too selfish to be reliable and true friends in the long run? Or is demanding a give-and-take basis for deeper social interaction a too high standard?
    Well...I'm certainly living it, so yes: it IS possible. All but one of my former girlfriends were reliable all the way. Furthermore I've got two friends whom I know since childhood. I'm not sure how close I'd trust them with personal things, but those friendships go DEEP. One of my colleagues also became one of my best friends, another is in the "just as well" category and our boss is also honest to the bone (I hope it's not a rare treat, but it took me some previous bosses who did NOT follow that). Kind of obvious, but my brother's as reliable to me as he can be.
    And last but by no means least: my current girlfriend. She'd go through a fire for me, like I would go to hers. It's not like we don't have our preferences or act selfish from time to time (which goes for everyone, really), but it's not how we define ourselves.

    • Have you ever experienced something like this (friends turning out to be opportunistic, bossy egoists knowing no self-criticism at all)?
    Ugh...one time I rented an appartment with a friend of mine. Not too long after that ended, I went back to my childhood home. Not long after that he was looking for an appartment. I was very glad to 'return the favor' (even though it was a bit smaller and my brother also lived with us...and our parents lived downstairs). But after a while, things became cracked. At first he didn't want to pay the cleaning lady which was part of the contract with our parents. Later my brother and me found out that he was behind on rent and hadn't even bothered telling us. This was already a bridge too far (brother and me payed the full rent...the deal was that he would pay us back), but it turned out that he had an outstanding electrical debt in that previous appartment...and he had put his address on our house, despite him saying he wouldn't do that. So not only did he owe us money, he also dragged us into his refusal to deal with his problems. Perhaps the worst part of it was that I was unemployed during that first time: I barely got 314 euro/month, and 200 went to the appartment (the remaining part was almost NOTHING). I never skipped a cent of the deal, and that was how he repayed me.
    I threw him out of our house. Would have done it literally if he hadn't at least acted a bit remorseful. Still...he refused to say sorry, so I've never really spoken to him again. Fucking asshole. :angry:

    An almost equal blow was in this BDSM community I joined. The story isn't exactly sexual, but might be NSFW, so I'll put it on spoilers regardless...
    So...here's the thing: I was a complete newby to BDSM or anything sexual for that matter. But I found a forum on which to post basic questions, got replies back from friendly folks and quickly joined all sorts of discussions, story threads and so on. It turned into actual (group) meetings and even some...let's just call them 'sessions' (these were 1 on 1, in case you were wondering). Everything was still great. I posted my experiences, got all sorts of compliments and encouragements. Results: I considered the hardcore posters (about ten to twenty people...it was a relatively small forum) my friends.

    The thing is: those first experiences were all with me as the submissive partner. At a certain point I started thinking whether or not I'd like the dominant role as well. So I met up with someone, had a session there and loved that just as well. So with suspecting nothing, I wrote down my experience. My play partner did the same.

    ...and all of the sudden all hell broke loose. Suddenly all those "friends" acted as if I violated her, despite nearly everyone not only knowing us IRL, but also despite the fact that she also had a good time.
    Somehow they saw something malicious or evil in her "she had a good time" and my "I absolutely loved it! :D " write-ups.
    Granted: quite some took my side in this as well, and wondered what the hell got into those others. But while they were supportive (that playpartner as well, btw...I had a session with her some time later, though that might have been the last time I saw her), the damage was done. The forum was meant to cater to beginning BDSM folk, but all it ended up doing was give me a sour taste in my mouth on my dominant side.
    I honestly did try to forgive them for their actions. But my then-girlfriend on the forum (who supported me, of course) told me something wise: who will be at your funeral? I learned that people who act friendly aren't necessary your friends. You might get to know them, you might see each other at meetings, heck...you can even go with them to sauna's or weekend resorts...but they might not show up at your funeral.

    A last example I'll keep brief for personal reasons: one girlfriend tricked me into pregnancy. I absolutely loved her, but she abused that fact to try to extort me. It...I don't want to talk more about that, right now. Let's just say that yes: "bossy egoists knowing no self-criticism at all" aplied to her. To a downright frighting degree.
    • Any ideas how to avoid relationships like this (early warning signs)?
    *sigh*
    No. :sad:
    When I look back at that abusive girlfriend, I saw absolutely zero warning signs. Nothing. Nada. It's like she was suddenly possessed.
    That BDSM community? I chalk that up to group hysteria, but certainly didn't see it coming.
    That friend with the rental problems...erm...maybe. Beforehand, he could talk about others as if they were nothing. Nothing scary or even explicit. Just a "oh, yeah...that guy? I don't care about him." or something in that vein. I thought it was just his kind of humor (heh...I've probably said somethign similar). Still: I was blindsided.
    • Any ideas how to deal with people like this?
    A both simple and hard advice: cut off ties as soon and as severely as possible.
    That friend? Never spoken to him again. Because we've got mutual friends, I hear he's still around, but I'd rather never see him again (unless he apologizes, which he's not going to do...it's over ten years ago, ffs).
    That community? I hung around for some months, but never really felt happy there afterwards. I felt like they just wanted a part of me and ignore me for who I really was. There was one woman whom I tried talking sense into, but still refused to hear me for whom I really was. I never spoke with her again (she died since then...I didn't go to her funeral).
    And that girlfriend...It was a close one, but she got rid of the foetus at the last second. She tried to stirr up controversies after that, but that died down after a lawyer intervened (again: don't want to talk more about it).


    ...Christ: I feel like I should erase this entire post. It's the truth, and it might help you. But it's focussing too much on the negative aspects. So lemme tell you a few positive things to end this post...

    * one of my childhood friends, my colleague and my brother I've since joined in a monthly board game meeting. It's awesome. Well...it was awesome for the two times we held it (thanks again, covid-19 :unsure:)
    * the other childhood friend became a dad roughly half a year before I did. He helped a bit with our renovations, I helped him put up a heavy concrete fence with another friend of him (ours? I knew him, but not as well). We still call regularly
    * not mentioned before, but my father-in-law has a heart of gold. Without him, our renovations wouldn't even be half where they are now.
    * my girlfriend and me have been in a relationship for about 5.5 years now. We still tell each other we love each other on an almost daily basis.

    So...it IS possible. There ARE good people out there. Don't lose hope, and you'll find them. :)
     
  11. Taleweaver

    Taleweaver Storywriter
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    Oh, right...I forgot to mention someone.

    I can't really tell how or when it started. I've been on this site for what...over ten years now? I've been blogging from time to time for some years as well, and slowly shifted to the different parts (though still haven't read about e.g. consoles I don't have). I can't really say when this guy started reading and/or following me, or why. It's not because I tend to give away steam keys here from time to time. I don't think it's because of my political views. I think it was because of some personal bloggings, but still...most people just post a like or reply with a basic response. This guys follows me, asks how I am sometimes weeks later and is genuinely friendly all the time. I haven't seen him. Probably never will. But as someone who has seen quite some people he chatted with on forums, I dare say this guy would be as close to a friend as a virtual-only contact would go.

    I'm talking of @alexander1970. I...honestly should have mentioned him above before he liked my earlier post, but really: I dare say that he's a true friend for his friends and family, even if only on the way he's always nice and kind to people on this forum.

    @alexander1970 : thanks a lot for your mental support, mate. Perhaps I don't always show it enough, but this compliment is well deserved. :D :yay:
     
  12. Sonic Angel Knight

    Sonic Angel Knight GBAtemp Legend
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    Lemme try not to be cynical for a moment. I believe that, not everyone is bad, but is hard to find good. Is just so many people want to take more than give in a relationship. Probably cause they can get away with it, or fear of not coming out on top of things, Leverage... like the loser of a divorce settlement. People hate to lose.

    So I guess it works better if both remain equal in relationship which can be boring, but safe is boring. :ninja:
     
  13. th3joker

    th3joker GBAtemp Fan
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    The fantasy of deep meaningful close friendships akin to brotherly love is a false reality portrayed by storys books movies social media ect. To expect or think its a entitlement to have friends who are more than just attention or energy vampires is just silly talk
     
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  14. Flofflewoffle

    Flofflewoffle GBAtemp Advanced Fan
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    certainly not an entitlement, but certainly not an impossibility either
     
  15. Hells Malice

    Hells Malice Are you a bully?
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    1: Unless you think you're the only reliable person on earth, the answer is obviously yes. Unless you don't trust yourself and that's why you're asking.
    2: I assume most people have had some sort of shitty friendship at one point. I shut that shit down pretty fast though, i'm very very picky with who I consider a friend. Always have been.
    3: It's kind of a broad subject so warning signs can vary greatly. If someone is friends with you and only seems to care about obtaining something and not actually being around you, that's a big sign. I had a dude on steam be very friendly and nice but he'd constantly nag about items in my steam inventory. He was clearly just around to get my shit.
    4: A knife, guns leave way too much evidence.

    Good friendships obviously exist but of course, socially awkward people probably don't think that because they've never been able to find one. It's give and take, if you're not willing to open up and trust someone you can't expect them to do the same.

    In your case it just seems like bad luck. Though you definitely set yourself up for it if you just willingly throw money and effort at people. A real simple test, refuse. See how they react. A real friend would be like "No problemo" whereas a toxic person would react less favourably. You shouldn't need to bribe your friends to be friends. I don't think I ever actively ask my friends for anything.

    I trust this nerd with my life @Chary so good friendships can and do exist. You just need to find 'em.
     
  16. KleinesSinchen

    OP KleinesSinchen GBAtemp's Backup Reminder + Fearless Testing Sina
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    Thank you all for the replies and opinions on that topic.

    I’ve thoroughly read everything multiple times. Very interesting and much "wisdom" ←suboptimal word… but hey.

    To be honest I expected only misanthropic and pessimistic short comments when posting this thread. GBAtemp never stops to amaze me! A forum or online community is not an adequate replacement for real friends. But it is more or less the only thing that is left. Nice to know many of you still believe humans are not all bad.
     
  17. Nobody_Important4u

    Nobody_Important4u Barely real
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    Well I think that it doesn't exist.

    It can sometimes be hard to accept this but people are selfish in nature, they act "good" and "selfless" only to feel better about themselves, if anything it's what makes them feel good but when it comes down to it, they are all selfish, besides that type of selfishness is much more rare than people who don't care and are just purely selfish, and people have hidden sides to them it takes time to stumble on them but they are in every human and those sides often lead to conflict, that's why good friendship can end up in ruins in short amount of time and fine people on surface can end up as biggest scum, that's why I never understood idea of marriage, you keep hearing people getting divorced but hearing about people living a happy live until the end is pretty rare and it's very plausible that there's some sinister reason for it, people are just like that the only person you can trust is yourself but you can lose it if not being careful, so you should focus on it instead.

    I know that it may sound like emo bambling but that's how it is and I prefer facing the truth instead of hiding and running from it because in the long run it's better to live like that instead of lying to yourself and accepting everything you see and hear, my motto is "doubt the world, understand how it works" and I encourage people to follow it too.
     
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  18. Silent_Gunner

    Silent_Gunner Crazy Cool Cyclops
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    Geez, guys and gals. Life isn't all about relationships in high school and college!

    I will say that I've had some pretty shaky experiences with someone in high school who I thought was my friend until I told him I was getting a gaming PC as opposed to buying an Xbox One. Given that a lot of the gams that released for the system also came to the PC (and on Steam, no less), I can say I'm glad I don't have to put up with that guy and his crap anymore. But that's someone from high school who I stuck with mostly because he was the only one who my parents wouldn't have had a problem with me hanging out with that wouldn't have been...well, problematic (in the "I had a crush on a girl ever since middle/high school, but never asked her out because her Christianity was different from my parents, so the relationship would've been DOA" kind of way)

    If you're going to find friends, you will probably have to be willing to put in time, effort, and probably some money to maintain said friendships. Trust me, when you have money to pay for the meals and buy gifts and everything in between, it can take a relationship to a whole new level. Granted, that's more of a BF/GF kind of thing, but that can happen in platonic friendships as well. In other words, expect to find more true friendships outside of high school and college if you're anything like the old stereotypical nerd from, like, the 80's and 90's.

    Relationships are kind of like playing a game of tossing a ball back and forth; you ask someone about things they're interested in, they ask you, and you just get to know the other person. No games, no PUA BS, and certainly no "RED PILLED CHAD BAD BOI GETS THE BAD GIRL" meme nonsense you would've seen on stuff like r/TheRedPill. That's a good mindset to get into for just any conversation in general. It indicates that you're interested in the person you're talking to and their opinion, and gives them a reason to potentially listen to you.

    As for how to deal with people that aren't good friends, the best thing to do is remain as calm as possible, be firm, but polite, and just try to patch things up as amicably as possible before you and the other person part ways.
     
  19. KleinesSinchen

    OP KleinesSinchen GBAtemp's Backup Reminder + Fearless Testing Sina
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    After thinking about this for some time I came to the following results (my own answers to the questions):
    • Indeed, it is theoretically possible to find reliable friends. It is theoretically possible to win the jackpot by buying a lottery ticket as well.
    • There are probably no general warning signs.
    • The only option is leaving bad (not-)friends → If this is possible. There might be reasons of overriding importance. This is a decision which must not be rushed.
    Again: Thank you all for the variety of opinions and reasoning on this topic.

    I give up. It’s not worth the effort: Actively searching just too be disappointed while hoping to gain something. Never gonna allow anybody getting near to me again.

    For the previous friendship: Time to burn bridges. Play time is over. This ends now!
    They will never, ever understand or accept anything. They will never, ever question themselves and will always think they did everything right and did not hurt me. Why bother?
     
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  20. godreborn

    godreborn GBAtemp Legend
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    I think so. I've made a few true friends on temp.
     
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