Can We Stop With The Name Calling Already ...

Discussion in 'World News, Current Events & Politics' started by cots, Jun 5, 2019.

  1. Memoir

    Memoir Hi, I'm Cynical!

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    In the Murderbox!
    The simple fact is that human nature can not be so easily defined. Our biggest mistake was trying to put a word to every action and feeling.
     
  2. Glyptofane

    Glyptofane Death Dealer

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    I have this joke about my son with my wife when he comes out as trans I scream "Oh please just be gay". He won't be though. He's going to be a Nazi.
     
  3. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    I don't think it was a mistake to start the long march toward progress on human rights. The mistake is the belief that any one doctrine is infallible, that no more progress is necessary. That's how we end up with priests who think it's okay to engage in pedophilia, but not okay to marry women.

    Yeah that's not the way kids work. If you try to make his decisions for him, the result is going to be an extremely rebellious teenager. He's more likely to end up Antifa if you try to force Nazism on him.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Jun 19, 2019
  4. Glyptofane

    Glyptofane Death Dealer

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    I know, you're probably right. I thought about it. They are saying the teenagers now are the most conservative since like WW1. I was thinking it's backlash against the indoctrination public schooling but also mostly their Bernie Bros millenial parents.
     
  5. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    Who is "they?" With a cursory glance it seems to be easy to find articles suggesting either: conservative media says Gen Z is moving to the right, liberal media says they're moving further left. The only election so far that a reasonable number of Gen Z voters have been able to participate in was 2018, and it does seem they went mostly for liberal candidates. Only time will tell if that trend is going to continue.
     
  6. Glyptofane

    Glyptofane Death Dealer

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    You know who "they" are, but I really just did mean media in the general sense that time. I forget where I read that, but it was like a year or two ago, so I did the cursory glance after your reply and saw that the predictions/polls really do vary almost as wishful thinking depending on the publisher.
     
  7. SG854

    SG854 If It Bleeds, We Can Kill It

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    Female Athletes are suing making a civics complaint against Trans Women competing against them.



    The lawsuit is about violation of Title 9 that gave women protections against discrimination in education and sports, and complaint is that allowing Trans Women compete in female sports reverses 50 years of female advancement.


    The complaint says that CIAC Policy allows boys to displace girls from advancement to post season competition because of superior athletic ability and performance advantages. And girls will lose acknowledgements, opportunities, scholarships, and other benefits.


    Basically the point where you give opportunities and rights to certain groups, you take away opportunities and rights for others.



    Trans females are recognized as biological males. From physical strength to bone density to muscle mass.





    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailywire.com/news/48568/breaking-teen-athletes-challenge-ct-policy-amanda-prestigiacomo?amp

    https://www.adflegal.org/detailspag...ticut-policy-that-abolishes-girls-only-sports



    The complaint link below. It lists run times between male and female, showing males outcompeting females, showing physiological differences on performance between boys and girls, and athletic performance in different sports.


    http://www.adfmedia.org/files/SouleComplaintOCR.pdf




    I knew something like this will happen sooner or later.


    Like I said before, I’m not going to engage in debate because i’ll be wasting my time. This was in my recommended news section and i’ll let other people go at this one and talk about cross sex hormones. I already have my thoughts but I won’t say much.
     
    Last edited by SG854, Jun 20, 2019
  8. AmandaRose

    AmandaRose Do what I do. Hold tight and pretend it’s a plan

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    Funny how bone density is meantioned when several scientific studies have proven transgender women have pretty much the same bone density as cis women.

    https://www.mdedge.com/obgyn/articl...-ht-have-lower-bone-density-more-fat-mass-men
     
  9. SG854

    SG854 If It Bleeds, We Can Kill It

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  10. AmandaRose

    AmandaRose Do what I do. Hold tight and pretend it’s a plan

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    Transgender women on HT have lower bone density, more fat mass than men.


    The title clearly says transgender women have lower bone density than men.



    Also if you actually read what I linked to it clearly says
    Lumbar spine density was lower than in reference men but similar to that of reference women
     
  11. SG854

    SG854 If It Bleeds, We Can Kill It

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    Like I said. I have not shared my opinions on the matter.

    I’m just linking articles on what the Title 9 lawsuit is about. Those are not my thoughts. Whether or not I agree I have not shared.

    I also mention in my post that people can talk about cross sex hormones. Which is what the article you linked mentioned in the Title, Trans Women on HT. Basically they are being physiologically altered with hormones. So people can talk about it’s use and how old of age when taking it can they be considered a eligible. And about Trans that have not taken HT.

    So this shows there is clear biological differences to male and females. And 2) if there wasn’t then they wouldn’t need cross sex hormones to make changes.


    I’m guessing you made assumptions. But like I said I’m not going to waste my time talking about this and i’ll just watch other people and hear what they say.
     
    Last edited by SG854, Jun 20, 2019
  12. cots
    OP

    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    Possibly, could you start a new thread? This is interesting, but not related to the topic I started. I'd like to address the issue, but Chary mentioned that we need to stay on topic.
     
  13. Glyptofane
    This message by Glyptofane has been removed from public view by WeedZ, Jun 20, 2019, Reason: Actual hate speech.
    Jun 20, 2019
  14. cots
    OP

    cots GBAtemp Maniac

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    So, I guess I'l roll with it.

    Doesn't surprise me. Just because you think you're a women in your head doesn't change the sex your were assigned at birth nor does chopping off any body parts and replacing them with others. I believe it would be unfair to allow people that were born males to compete with females if the rules state it's a female only event (which they do). No one is being discriminated against. You have male sports and female sports, because, there are only two sexes.

    Of course, the people going around trying to discriminate against others by calling them transphobic and trying to manipulate and control the situation and silence others are the ones that are showing their true colors. They also think they are activists, but simply posting on Twitter all day long isn't any type of work. Try telling a Mexican farm worker that your back hurts from sitting in your chair for hours on end pretending to be an activist. They really are the new Rev. George Lee's. Give me a break. The trans "issue" isn't a major civil rights issue. It barely effects anyone personally. Trans are such a low minority which are categorized under another minority. I think these kids need to read their history books before comparing themselves and their made up causes to the past. It's like trying to force discussion on everyone about minor rectal bleeding.
     
    Last edited by cots, Jun 20, 2019
  15. subcon959

    subcon959 teh retro

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    I didn't read every single page so I might've missed it but no one here has argued that gender and sex are the same thing right? I said that because the athletics thing is only contentious if you need to force people into seeing gender and sex as the same.
     
  16. Lacius

    Lacius GBAtemp Legend

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    People have mistakenly argued that gender and sex are the same thing, yes.
     
  17. YetoJesse

    YetoJesse GBAtemp Regular

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    Is this EOF?...

    *double checks

    Hmmm.. it's not...

    On topic: Words are bull anyway and as I do not want to be banned from this place, I'll refrain from using my preferred way of speech.
    At a certain point, people got too into boasting 'Freedom of speech' which went from phrases such as:
    "I, as person A, don't feel valued as much as person B."
    into:
    "I have a right to call you whatever I want, even if it's degrading"
    into:
    "No matter what you say, I'll just say you said this and that to make myself feel superiour."

    At this point, we reached this one fantastic threshold:
    If there is Freedom of Speech, than Freedom of Opinion should be just as important.

    Example. We use the N-word in our inner-circle only to refer to people having certain dark tan. which mainly means they're either from Nigeria, Africa, Suriname etc.
    (our inner circle does indeed also mean the people that fit to this group, yet out of respect, we tend to ask for said person's approval first, preferably in the utmost respectable way.)
    This gives said people, in our opinion, also the right to come with their names for us 'white people'.

    Freedom of Opinion: As some are trying to disapprove said word, we prefer taking the negativity out of it and only use said negativity as satire.

    this ofcourse means that certain people will call us racist, yet it's okay to say that all asians look alike and call a chinese guy japanes or vice versa. (Wonderful world we're in.).

    In other words, I don't believe in all this trans, lgbt, pride bullcrap, just as much as I believed in these cults labeled as religions.
    I prefer using the negativity around these made up words as dark-humour/satire and not give any further attention to it whatsoever.

    Same with being called a racist. If you're happy with calling me a racist, well good for you. Fetch yourself a cake, buttercup.
    But seriously, it's bothering you more than it's bothering me and to be frank, after all these years growing up, being bothered from all sides, I've sort of lost interest taking these snowflakes seriously.

    TL;DR?: If you like humping a stuffed animal and it makes you happy, good for you! Just don't pay attention to me calling you a fag.
    In the end, we're both laughing and if you lose your stuffed animal, I'll still help you find it, mate.
     
    Glyptofane likes this.
  18. subcon959

    subcon959 teh retro

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    Oh dear, well I think I'll just leave it then as it will undoubtedly get out of hand quickly. Silly me, I actually genuinely thought that the athletics thing was pretty clear cut and not nuanced like most other issues.
     
    Subtle Demise and Lacius like this.
  19. AmandaRose

    AmandaRose Do what I do. Hold tight and pretend it’s a plan

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    Well seeing as has how people keep mistakingly saying trans athletes especially trans women have an unfair advantage in sports I'm gonna leave this here. Its just one of many reports that have been done that say trans athletes have zero advantage.

    https://www.lboro.ac.uk/research/spotlights/transgender-in-sport/


    Also The Canadian scientist Joanna Harper, published a study in 2015 that showed male-to-female transgender athletes tended to run significantly slower after having hormone therapy to reduce testosterone, to the point where they had no advantage over other women.
     
    Last edited by AmandaRose, Jul 29, 2019
  20. notimp

    notimp GBAtemp Addict

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    I'd actually call you someone that culturally appropriates then. And your specific way of doing it - most recently became popular because of a kind of popcultural phenomenon on the far right - I like to call "the rise of the pepe people". (After Pepe the frog.)

    The thing is, that none of this was done naively. The far right had a tough PR problem to solve - with all different forms of racism having been pretty clearly labeled as racism for the better part of three, four generations now.


    So they got inventive. Following the same sentiment of no 'insert cultural subgroup here' in my country - they suddenly wouldnt want to call themselves racist - but 'cultural nativist' (everyone should live n the country they are born in). Makes absolutely no sense (what you anti travelers now?) but on the surface level its just ambiguous enough - that it didn't trigger the "yep thats racist" threshhold in society - for maybe two years or so. Nowadays - knowing how it came to be - we would say, that yes - its racist.

    Another thing they came up with is to post openly racist content - but insisting, that they are doing so as part of a hilarious satire - that people didn't really get. Because there was none. It followed the principle of 'say something horrible' then add 'just kidding' at the and, and people dont quite know how to react anymore. Thats all the magic, behind the racially charged pepe memes. Its far right propaganda, making it possible again for people to 'talk' about racially charged stereotyping that was a societal taboo for generations.

    So you might not like those cults people call religions, but you seemed to have found your own one of these which you are pretty happy with. And thats also only there because someone thought it would be a wonderful way to manipulate people into tolerating stuff, they didn't tolerate for generations. (Societal taboo.)


    There are a few inklings, that you do what you do - by sharing tropes (stuff other people said), and that you havent thought this through entirely. Or that you are only out there to convince people, of lets say a certain mental aptitude (everytime I say 'stupid people exist' a moderater in here insists that they have to censor it, because its not respectful to whoever I'm accusing, so I have to find ways to say it - without saying it (kind of making the bigger point here...)) -- very similar to professional spammers who only target the not quite educated - because percentage wise, they are loosing time with more intelligent folks.


    Here are two of those inklings. "I'm sorry, but are you from Nigeria [country in africa], Africa, Suriname - because I would wan't to call you the N word" is not something people ask in real life. I'm sorry to tell you.

    The N word is partly 'usable' (with permission) in certain black subcultures, because it has power. The word was used for centuries to denigrate an entire group of people as 'less than humans'. In concept, and in practice. So black subcultures have tried and successfully culturally appropriated it - stripping it entirely of its original meaning - and "owning" it. This is a psychological concept - where something looses (implied, social) power over you, once you make/use/do it yourself/your own. It takes the sting out of it. They took what it meant for generations, and they made something less horrible - bordering on endearment. Its used that way to 'get over it'. But as soon as anyone else in society - pronounces - 'No, no - I also only use it that way - so 'they' can get over it' - kind of doesnt work anymore, does it.

    So its still taboo - for pretty much everyone - so dont try.

    There is power in this taboo as well. And no it is not a problem. Not a problem even close to the original issue, that we are trying to deal with here as society.

    The next inkling that you might have not thought so good is, that you say that you would just be using the word - out of a sense of satire, irony maybe. ('If people call me a racist for that, then its not my fault.')

    Now - satire, and irony are concepts (emotions) that are born out of loss. And a way to deal with sadness. So - you only venture into satire - usually - if you know of a certain thing - pretty much by heart, and because of living through it - know that it is wrong, and that you cant change it. And still have to deal with it. You don't 'make just a funny a joke with satire' to be funny. And if you do - it doesnt work.

    Thats usually also something you wouldnt have to follow up with 'you can call me a racist, but', because the distinction should be very clear.

    So here is your easy guideline from today on - if you have to do a double take on something with 'you can call me racist, but..' with it in the latter part of a sentence, chances are - that you said something racist. That you understood that it was racist. And that you are now worried about public perception - and now are backpadling.

    But the good thing is, that you caught yourself doing it, so you know what it meant, and social shunning (taboos) still work as intended.


    'I only use the negativity of those words to make fun of them' thereby doesnt work - AT ALL.

    You dont decide what meaning the word gay has. Or yew. Or transsexual. Or... society does. To 'make fun' of the negativity in those words - you must understand that, when you are doing that - you are stripping them of meaning.

    You do that intentionally - so people start to look at certain concepts at all, or jut so they don't always associate negative thoughts with a certain word - just the same. But you never do it "just because they are negative".

    Because from that sentiment alone, all the world ever needs is some sugar frosting, and some helium balloons.


    People that devide the world in toxic (negative), and positive (happy) - havent quite understood how the world, societies, or language works.

    When it comes to loaded terms. A good joke always is insightful, and a bad joke is one that wasnt needed.

    If you want to challange certain positions of the lets say SJW community, by all means - do it. But never do it because 'they so negative'.
     
    Last edited by notimp, Jul 29, 2019
  21. subcon959

    subcon959 teh retro

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    I'm having a hard time trusting any of papers I've read on this topic (for either side) as they always seem to be by people with a specific agenda. I don't really want to debate the issue though as I don't want to offend anyone here over something I definitely don't feel as strongly about as they probably do.
     
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