Austria first country to make Covid vaccine mandatory

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fischermasamune

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According to Geert Vanden Bossche (DVM, PhD):

https://www.geertvandenbossche.org/...s-to-be-considered-a-public-health-experiment

"First, there is no evidence that any of the C-19 vaccines proven to be efficacious in a clinical research setting will prevent the virus from successfully exploiting its evolutionary capacity when challenged by widespread immune pressure exerted by the population on the very protein that these vaccines are directed at (i.e., at spike [ S ] protein). However, population-level immune pressure on S protein is the inevitable consequence of mass vaccination. There isn’t even any precedent to the use of non-replicating viral vaccines in mass vaccination campaigns conducted during a pandemic, or even epidemic, of a highly mutable virus.

[...]

Mass vaccination programs previously conducted to combat viral epidemics/pandemics (e.g., smallpox, polio, measles, yellow fever) have nothing in common with the ongoing mass vaccination campaigns today as those viruses are very different in terms of their pathogenesis, transmissibility, route of infection, potential reservoirs, predominant effector mechanisms involved in antiviral immunity, susceptibility of population segments, as well as with regard to the vaccines used (all prior vaccination campaigns involved live-attenuated virus).

In addition, vaccine efficacy as assessed during clinical trials is different from viral effectiveness, which reflects how well a vaccine performs in the field.

[...]

Furthermore, re-exposure to circulating viral variants in the presence of low affinity antibodies (**) could potentially provoke life-threatening antibody-dependent enhancement of C-19 disease (ADE). Clearly, results from clinical studies do not permit the drawing of any conclusions regarding the impact of viral exposure in the presence of low affinity antibodies. Consequently, big question marks remain as to the likelihood that ADE, or whether other immunogenicity-related adverse events could occur as an indirect result of vaccination (6). It is important to note that previous efforts to develop a SARS-CoV-1 (***) vaccine had been abrogated due to the occurrence of ADE in preclinical models (7).

[...]

Based on all the above, widespread deployment of current Covid-19 vaccines in large-scale vaccination campaigns should first and foremost be considered highly experimental and empirical in terms of the efficacy and safety (****) outcome as well as in terms of the impact on individual and public health. Because the experimental use of current Covid-19 vaccines raises serious concerns regarding their effectiveness and their potential to cause serious harm to both individuals and the public at large, one can only conclude that vaccination mandates are completely unethical."
 

stanna

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Covid is rife in our town at the moment hundreds of kids in the secondary school have it, loads of parents and staff at nursery school, my other half is on school WhatsApp groups with hundreds of other parents, everybody is saying, we thought it was going to make us very ill but it's hasnt, cold symptoms at worst.
People on here are saying but what about all the deaths, hospitals are attributing covid to nearly every death nowadays, it's just not true, to many financial incentives to do so, and the few who are ill with covid with other comorbiditys are given midazolam injections to make them better which is a end of life drug that shuts down the kidneys and floods the lungs causing pneumonia and death within 5 days, very similar to a so called covid death, makes you wonder hey.
 
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the few who are ill with covid with other comorbiditys are given midazolam injections to make them better which is a end of life drug that shuts down the kidneys and floods the lungs causing pneumonia and death within 5 days, very similar to a so called covid death, makes you wonder hey.

Think you went too far with that one lol
 

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Now that's just disingenuous and ignoring so many things others have been saying. It's not solely the unvaccinated's fault, but many of them are still part of the problem.
  • You can still get COVID-19 even if you're vaccinated, yes. However, the chances of you getting infected and suffering from heavier diseases that accompany COVID-19 is significantly lower, thus have a higher chance of survival.
  • You can still spread it while vaccinated, yes. However, vaccinated people can spread it less since the body actively fights and eliminates as much of the virus in the body, so there's less to spread overall compared to the unvaccinated. All the more reason to get the vaccine especially around people who are immunocompromised and can't take the vaccine.
  • If you go to events with huge amounts of people, of course it'll spread like crazy since lots of people are so near each other at close proximity that it's a lot easier to spread it around, vaccinated or not. All the more reason to get vaccinated anyways because it does help increase the odds of survival and getting milder effects.
  • It shouldn't have to be political. It's just like every other vaccine out there. It's to help protect others, not be some dividing political bullshit.
  • Did you know many schools require children to take certain vaccines before going to school? Obviously to protect the children and to lessen the spread of any potential virus/disease since children and teachers are grouped together in closed spaces, like classrooms.
It's not hard to see the issue when a huge majority of COVID-19 deaths are from the unvaccinated. Calling it a "cold on steroids" shows how ignorant you are and downplaying the threat of COVID-19 when it has infected and killed millions of lives within the past 2 years.

5 million dead and people still call it "only a cold" smh


There is zero proof that a lot of those people would of died by just the flu. Yes covid is a cold...well the flu on steroids. It kills not my point my point was the amount of self righteous fucks out there that think they are "holyer than thou" just because they get a shot. Want to tell everyone else what to do with their body. A LOT DOING IT WHILE PROTESTING THEIR RIGHT TO ABORTION. My body my choice only applies to the pregnant liberal is that it. Now just for your information I am vaccinated. It was my choice and i got the shot. I HAVE NO SELF DELUSIONS nor do i believe i have the right to force anything on anyone. Especially a un tested (well we currently testing it) vaccine to "help fight" (it dont even cure it just fights it....and while im here there in zero proof that it slows the spread of covid. I have seen countless vaccinated people contract and spread it.) Long story short noone has any right to demand someone else get this vaccine.
 
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The Catboy

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There is zero proof that a lot of those people would of died by just the flu. Yes covid is a cold...well the flu on steroids. It kills not my point my point was the amount of self righteous fucks out there that think they are "holyer than thou" just because they get a shot. Want to tell everyone else what to do with their body. A LOT DOING IT WHILE PROTESTING THEIR RIGHT TO ABORTION. My body my choice only applies to the pregnant liberal is that it. Now just for your information I am vaccinated. It was my choice and i got the shot. I HAVE NO SELF DELUSIONS nor do i believe i have the right to force anything on anyone. Especially a un tested (well we currently testing it) vaccine to "help fight" (it dont even cure it just fights it....and while im here there in zero proof that it slows the spread of covid. I have seen countless vaccinated people contract and spread it.) Long story short noone has any right to demand someone else get this vaccine.
It’s literally not the cold though. The cold is caused by Rhinoviruses, where as Covid 19 is caused by Coronaviruses. These are not the same thing and shouldn’t be treated as the same thing. As for the rest of your post, abortion only effects the individual having it, not getting vaccinated can effect an entire community. These are not comparable either. Would you like to provide the sources to you claim that vaccines don’t slow the spread of Covid?
 
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FAST6191

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How delightfully amusing
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41366-021-01016-9
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0245424
Primo journals, good scientists as far as I can tell (not really much of a biology type but if you make it to Nature... yeah) and peer reviewed for those that claim to care about such things.

Turns out being fat (about half the US population at present, if not more) does a number on the useful antibodies for this whole Wuhan coronavirus lark in patients (and actually has some serious negative ones for autoimmune fun and games).
If we are to be injecting people at the barrel of a gun under the auspices of not having them infect others/be hidden carriers/not taking up hospital resources as and when then do we also get to point one at fatties, slap the cake out of their hands and say get on the treadmill (granted the rates among the military and police make this a dubious proposition for enforcement)? In terms of harms done and risk averted then... yeah it is probably better than getting the few holdouts and that is not factoring in the other things associated with being fat (all the cancers*, heart disease, general autoimmune, diabetes and all that). Obesity is also framed as an epidemic ( https://www.who.int/news-room/facts-in-pictures/detail/6-facts-on-obesity if we think the world health organisation has credibility) if that helps and has death rates as cause/massive contributing factor also in the millions per annum (and likely more in years to come as the curve only gets worse).

* https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/obesity/obesity-fact-sheet https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20507889/

Or is medical ethics harder than some might naively think?
 
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Foxi4

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How delightfully amusing
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41366-021-01016-9
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0245424
Primo journals, good scientists as far as I can tell (not really much of a biology type but if you make it to Nature... yeah) and peer reviewed for those that claim to care about such things.

Turns out being fat (about half the US population at present, if not more) does a number on the useful antibodies for this whole Wuhan coronavirus lark in patients (and actually has some serious negative ones for autoimmune fun and games).
If we are to be injecting people at the barrel of a gun under the auspices of not having them infect others/be hidden carriers/not taking up hospital resources as and when then do we also get to point one at fatties, slap the cake out of their hands and say get on the treadmill (granted the rates among the military and police make this a dubious proposition for enforcement)? In terms of harms done and risk averted then... yeah it is probably better than getting the few holdouts and that is not factoring in the other things associated with being fat (all the cancers*, heart disease, general autoimmune, diabetes and all that). Obesity is also framed as an epidemic ( https://www.who.int/news-room/facts-in-pictures/detail/6-facts-on-obesity if we think the world health organisation has credibility) if that helps and has death rates as cause/massive contributing factor also in the millions per annum (and likely more in years to come as the curve only gets worse).

* https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/obesity/obesity-fact-sheet https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20507889/

Or is medical ethics harder than some might naively think?
“Being fat” is one of the biggest comorbidities in America linked not just to plummeted survival rates for COVID, but also increasing the risk of heart disease, cancer, diabetes and many other lead killer diseases. It’s by far a bigger “epidemic” than COVID.

Easy solution, people. SFE Therapy. Stop fucking eating.
 

wartutor

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It’s literally not the cold though. The cold is caused by Rhinoviruses, where as Covid 19 is caused by Coronaviruses. These are not the same thing and shouldn’t be treated as the same thing. As for the rest of your post, abortion only effects the individual having it, not getting vaccinated can effect an entire community. These are not comparable either. Would you like to provide the sources to you claim that vaccines don’t slow the spread of Covid?
Abortion effects the unborn baby, their future children and generations of possible people deleted by your one choice. Absurd way you look at things no wonder you think you should be able to tell one person what to do while screaming about being told not to directly murder. And i dont yave to link my source when replying to a post with zero support to their claim that it slows the spread because "your body is fighting and keeping the numbers down." The exact same thing your body naturally does just some get overwelmed and cant fight it quick enough (causing hospitalization and death) But i give you trying to make a point with your type that thinks they control everyone and everything is like telling a tree not to grow its roots in my septic. Eventually i have to cut it short and everything has shit on it afterwards. Good luck pushing the vaccine people will die over it. #fjb
 
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Lucaserf

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It’s literally not the cold though. The cold is caused by Rhinoviruses, where as Covid 19 is caused by Coronaviruses. These are not the same thing and shouldn’t be treated as the same thing. As for the rest of your post, abortion only effects the individual having it, not getting vaccinated can effect an entire community. These are not comparable either. Would you like to provide the sources to you claim that vaccines don’t slow the spread of Covid?
He is unable to, don't bother
 
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tabzer

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@CatBoy still thinks its mother's choice to not get an abortion isn't adversely affecting people to this day. However, if she did terminate @CatBoy as an internal love baby, I'm sure that @CatBoy wouldn't be around to spout the nonsense about not being affected by such choice.

If the definition of life is so fluid (subjective), then perhaps it could be said that they aren't even truly living a life now. Post-delivery abortions anyone? Pro-abortion and pro-forced-vaccination seem to be conflicting values, but are quite compatible in someone who disrespects life.
 
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With the new Omicron B.1.1.529 Variante all the Vaccines are seem more or less "useless"....

I really hope,one Day,Mankind will understand.....
I hope people understand that it’s the action constantly spreading the virus that caused this. Vaccines aren’t at fault for people not being vaccinated and continuing the spread
 
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I hope people understand that it’s the action constantly spreading the virus that caused this. Vaccines aren’t at fault for people not being vaccinated and continuing the spread
Not reading the entire thread and the whole anti-vaxx vs force-vaxx argument is tiring and tired, but I saw this post in the recent content tab and this is just silly. Nature of covid makes it so the virus is highly unstable and constantly mutating. You can't eradicate covid like we did polio, just like we can't eradicate influenza. The virus just mutates, all we can hope for is that it mutates into more infectious but less deadly variants, and that we develop better drugs to treat sick people/make a vaccine with a broader range of efficacy
 
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Not reading the entire thread and the whole anti-vaxx vs force-vaxx argument is tiring and tired, but I saw this post in the recent content tab and this is just silly. Nature of covid makes it so the virus is highly unstable and constantly mutating. You can't eradicate covid like we did polio, just like we can't eradicate influenza. The virus just mutates, all we can hope for is that it mutates into more infectious but less deadly variants, and that we develop better drugs to treat sick people/make a vaccine with a broader range of efficacy
There is no “forced-vaxx” there only people who understand vaccines vs those who don’t and continue to refuse to learn anything different. That being said, it is those who are unvaccinated that have been the largest contributing factor to the virus continuing to spread. The largest portion of the population still getting infected are those not vaccinated. This isn’t to say unvaccinated are the only reason why the virus is mutating but to say that them continuing the spread only makes matters worse. This makes preventive measures far more difficult when the virus is continuing to spread and mutates further. The best memes of dealing with Covid (and really all other viruses,) is to get vaccinated and other preventive measures.
 
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Homlet

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There is no “forced-vaxx” there only people who understand vaccines vs those who don’t and continue to refuse to learn anything different. That being said, it is those who are unvaccinated that have been the largest contributing factor to the virus continuing to spread. The largest portion of the population still getting infected are those not vaccinated. This isn’t to say unvaccinated are the only reason why the virus is mutating but to say that them continuing the spread only makes matters worse. This makes preventive measures far more difficult when the virus is continuing to spread and mutates further. The best memes of dealing with Covid (and really all other viruses,) is to get vaccinated and other preventive measures.
Vaccination rate has nothing to with virus mutation is all I said. Vaccine do reduce severity of symptoms and, to an extent, transmission.
>The largest portion of the population still getting infected are those not vaccinated
And countries with a 100% vaccination rate still see plenty of infections. Covid won't be eradicated, no more than the flu has been. Anyways, I'm out, I really don't care for this argument. Have a nice evening
 

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There is no “forced-vaxx” there only people who understand vaccines vs those who don’t and continue to refuse to learn anything different.
Were we reading a different thread? Plenty of people thus far have seemingly been all for considerable levels of force being applied and legal mandates to have it done (they call it force of law for a reason). That would be the force element.
There are several that are quite familiar with viral spreading mechanics* (they are the same whether you are doing evolution, microbial stuff, psychology to an extent -- there is a reason it is called going viral, or computery things) as well as baseline medical ethics that say forcing something into someone with the capacity to refuse treatment is all kinds of unethical, even if it is better (for some definition of the term, possibly even a generally accepted one) for them and society at large. Some from this and the above even beginning to broach the topic of what it might take to go into a force scenario (absolutism is a hard one for this where other things might be easier to go with that for).
There are several that might have glommed onto the previous delineation as a means to an end, or end run perhaps, from other aspects.
Several that might be seeking a better choice (and there is a difference between in some ways untested, or at least scarcely tested, and things that have been tested for decades, even if minimal).
Several that are pondering the nature of endemic.
Several that are from the various broadly anti crowds (of which there are several very distinct flavours with their own histories, beliefs and makeups).

*I might even place a bet on this set having more of those with a greater familiarity with the mechanics where it gets really down and dirty than those of the previous set.
 
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