Any Homebrew app that can load .3DS ROMs directly?

Discussion in '3DS - Homebrew Development and Emulators' started by Platinum Lucario, Feb 6, 2017.

  1. Platinum Lucario
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    Platinum Lucario GBAtemp Fan

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    I do have two questions I'd like to ask. Is there any Homebrew app that can actually load .3DS ROMs via SD card? And I'm not talking about the .CIA files in which are installed to the SD card, I'm talking about emulating Game Cards in the same way that Gateway CFW does, but instead loading from a specific directory on the SD card.

    Also, is there any open source CFW alternative to loading flash cards in the same way as Gateway CFW does with it's own multi-ROM loader? From what I've noticed, Luma3DS cannot load flash cards such as Gateway 3DS flash card.

    I really haven't found anything that can so far that can load flash cards or even load .3ds ROMs directly from a directory on the SD card.

    Edit: Also, don't get me wrong. I don't really use Gateway's CFW, but I'm just wondering if there ever will be anything that can load .3ds ROMs or to loading flash cards without having to use Gateway's CFW.
     
    Last edited by Platinum Lucario, Feb 6, 2017


  2. Jao Chu

    Jao Chu GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    straya m8
    Nope, there is no public way to launch CCIs or .3DS roms on any custom firmware.

    Rumors are on IRC and a single post on gbatemp (which I haven't been able to find for years) there is actually a private dev who implemented CCI/3DS loading into a private CFW which never saw the (public) light of day.....

    It was confirmed by a few respected devs too.

    Why do you feel guilty about making it seem as though your wanting to use Gateway to the public?

    Gateway 3DS is not a swear word and is still relevant due to it's cheat searching engine which is far superior to any other cheat solution available to this date.

    When used in conjunction with luma3DS, it's fairly safe and offers CCI/3DS loading and cheat searching which are two crital features that Luma3DS is lacking and will most probably never have implemented due to the complexity of them.
     
    Last edited by Jao Chu, Feb 6, 2017
  3. Platinum Lucario
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    Platinum Lucario GBAtemp Fan

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    Yeah, I thought there wasn't any public way to launch CCI or 3DS ROMs. Gateway's RAM editing and searching functions are the only reasons I use it most of the time. Only downsides to Gateway CFW is that it doesn't have multi-emuNAND support or even loading the NATIVE_FIRM keys directly from the emuNAND (which instead uses the ones loaded from the NATIVE_FIRM on the sysNAND).

    It would be nice if there was public and open-source ways of launching flash cards, as well as CCI and 3DS ROMs. That way there would be more support and development for them.
     
  4. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    There isn't one and mostly because no one has given a convincing enough argument for one to be made. Most people are like, "Why? We have CIAs and those can be installed directly to the system." And others will be like, "Buy a Gateway/Sky3DS."
    Basically lack of community interest and community backlash prevents a project like this from taking off.
     
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  5. Platinum Lucario
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    Platinum Lucario GBAtemp Fan

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    I can understand where they are coming from. I'm just also thinking about the possibilities of things that can be done with 3DS/CCIs which cannot be done with CIAs. Such as usage on other consoles without the need of having to extract the saves and transfer them over to another console. I'm thinking more of easier portability and it being as easy as ejecting the flash card and/or SD card out and putting it into another 3DS system without the hassle of having to extract the save and inject it into the other system.
     
  6. Jao Chu

    Jao Chu GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    Most members on gbatemp seem to have a problem with paying money for a piracy device when they're actually indirectly (I hate using this word in this context, but for lack of a better word; here it goes.....) 'stealing' paid software..... The hypocrisy, although being essentially very vague, is very real and a non-apparent to the proponents :rofl2:

    Everybody here has used freeshop or made eShop purchases at some stage... CIA installation takes up over half of the entire time spent during download/install. Wouldn't it just be easier to make a Google drive/Mega client to download a CCI/3DS and launch it directly as opposed to CIA install?

    It's no lie that the 3DS's chipset is underpowered and processing power + storage read/write speeds are the limitation, but if we could just download CCI/3DS images directly and launch them from the SD, essentially emulating them like a legit cartridge, it would be pretty damn convenient!

    I'm looking at you, dev who has private CCI/3DS loading CFW! :teach:
     
  7. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    Realistically the best way to get a project rolling is community interesting. It's obviously possible to make something like this happen, but if there's no demand for it, why make it?
    There actually was a thread of people interested in getting a project like this started, but it was quickly killed by the community. Which is the second problem. There's obviously a demand for something like this, in fact there have been several threads made requesting for a homebrew like this to be made. But the community just ends up attacking the project and heavily discouraging anyone from starting a project. Basically, the community is killing projects by not allowing anyone to suggest anything against the "norm."
     
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  8. Jao Chu

    Jao Chu GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    straya m8
    Just like the last time you replied to one of my comments, i too rarely 'like' your posts, but you speak the truth entirely here, so enjoy my 'like'

    The norm is ripping directly from Nintendo's server's and blasphemy is using Gateway 3DS and Sky3DS.

    But eventually the 3DS CDN will be turned off.... What happens when those ISO sites get busted? What happens when nintendo lodges DCMA claims against google drive and mega? What happens when peoples 3DS's start becomming bricked with CIAs on them that could be dumped?

    The retro gamers in 20 years need CCIs and 3DS roms + methods to play them in the future.

    All you skilled devs, drop your bullshit moralfag ways and write a ROM loader already, for historical proposes!
     
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  9. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    I don't think it's so much of a "moral" issue. If "morals" were an issue, sig-patching really wouldn't be a thing, because I mean, come on. But really just community interest. People aren't allowed to want something like this because "CIAs exist." And the second someone brings that argument into play, everyone jumps on the same train and trashes the thread for being different. Which more often than not, silences the community because no one wants to go against the norms and or no one wants their thread locked because of the flamewar.
    What we really need is for the community to get it's head out of it's ass and realize that not everything has be so black and white. Yes, we have one method of loading games, but that doesn't mean it should be the only method. Maybe I don't want to have to install a hacked CIA to test it, that's fucking twice the space needed to install it and that's only for testing! That could easily be solved with a .3ds loader. Drag n drop your hacked rom, test it out. No installing, no buying a flashcart, ect. Basically this is a win for everyone. But the community doesn't want to see it that way. They seem to take it as some form of personal attack on their current way of living and take it to a personal level. Then a group of these people start forming and trash the thread.
    This is what happens every single time this is brought up and no one wants to listen to what the other side has to say. That's what's holding a project like this from happening. The sigma of dealing with community backlash over something that is actually helpful for them.
     
    Last edited by Lilith Valentine, Feb 6, 2017
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  10. aos10

    aos10 look at me,shitposting about GW,i am so cool

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    Question maybe not that related to the object of this thread
    Who made .3DS extension?
    I know it's like .iso format but for Nintendo 3ds,but who made it,Nintendo or gateway?
    or it's just a name and the extension doesn't matter and it's there just to know if that file belong to certain system?

    Know that I'm thinking about it,maybe this was stupid question.
     
    Last edited by aos10, Feb 6, 2017
  11. Jao Chu

    Jao Chu GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    straya m8
    I'm not an academic intellectual, so perhaps 'moral' was an incorrect selection of vocabulary. Maybe 'cuturally implantated negative preconceptions about paying for piracy' was a better choice of words?

    I think ignorance plays a large part here. The lack of interest for CCI/3DS loading comes from the anti-flashcard brigade that have gbatemp join dates of post Palantine firmware days. They don't understand that back in 2013-14, flashcards and .3DS is how we did things back then. All the 2015 join-date know it alls with 10,000 posts read old "gateway bricks consoles on purpose" comments and assume the worst. Even though without gateway team, turning the 4.1 Mset exploit into a publicly usable form (after the 3dbrew guys had it private FOR YEARS without sharing) we absolutely would not have nice things like A9LH and safefirmlaunchhax in 2017.[/QUOTE]

    Could not agree more. The scene as a wholes' own cancerous ways (us and them, free vs paid hack methods) are actually crippling it, inadvertently. Having redundant methods of piracy in the current age of console security could never be a bad thing! Especially as the hardware ages....

    Agree entirely for the reasons in my paragraph above, especially for in the future when PC emulation of 3DS hardware has reached levels, of say, the SNES with higan/bsnes, its easier to have clean, bit-for-bit dump of the original software as opposed to having a virtual 3DS file system with AES-128 encryption for CIA installation on PC....

    And legitimate 'scene-rules' call for exact one-for-one copies of game without decryption and sig patching rubbish...

    More great points here. I swear in another life, we're supposed to be friends.... Couldn't of said it better myself. Have another 'like'
     
    Last edited by Jao Chu, Feb 6, 2017
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  12. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    I am not going to lie or pretend I wasn't part of the problem. I was one of those members who would have scuffed at this idea. But I an epiphany a few weeks ago. I realized that the reason we weren't seeing new projects is because people like me were attacking them. Here I was playing holier than thou, while completely ignoring what I was doing over here. It blew my fucking mind what I was doing, I wasn't helping the community. I was showing a community that it's perfectly acceptable to attack projects because look, a well known and trusted member is doing it! Then I would turn around be like, "Look at you people! Being horrible people, while I sit on my throne made of my perfection!"
    So I am here to fix the damages I helped create. I am actually trying to look at projects from a different angle and maybe help push the community in a different direction. Maybe instead of scuffing a project, look at the practical use a project could give.
     
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  13. ihaveamac

    ihaveamac GBAtemp Guru

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    probably someone in the "scene" came up with it because it would make the most sense. official ext is .cci, like .srl for NDS (I think? only seen in Wii U DS VC)
     
  14. Jao Chu

    Jao Chu GBAtemp Advanced Maniac

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    I think everybody is guilty for taking a certain side (myself included) be it one or the other. Cognitive biases are just one of the disadvantages of having an advanced and powerful organ such as the human brain and as a result, every single person on this planet has experienced them at one stage.

    I have certainly been guilty of perhaps pandering to Gateway team and spreading the pro-flashcart + pro CCI/3DS loading word that my cognitive bias defined as gospel, while dispelling CIA installation for no reason at all.

    Forgive me for sounding like a spiritual enlightened twat (i dont buy into all that stuff) but we all need to stop the hate and work together to make the scene great in current times and preserve the games and homebrew we know and love for future generations :)
     
  15. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    I hope the community learns from this. This is how the threads used to be like before everyone start throwing shit at each other.
    It takes guts to admit fault.

    Still, all that out of the way. I think what we really need is to continue building up community support for this. I mean, once the community actually started working together and pushing to make an nds-loader, they ended up actually doing it. It's not good, but it's been made! Something like this can be done and most likely turn out better than that project.
    Plus I secretly don't care for installing CIAs. Like yeah freeShop is a thing, but I can't get ROM hacks on freeShop. So I have to delete large games, install the game, then redownload them again. It just sucks so hard to have to do that just to test out a ROM hack. If I could have a launcher that launched the .3DS file without installing it, that would save time and space.
    I know I could buy a Gateway. But I honestly don't have the money for one. Not to mention I don't feel like I would get my moneys worth out of it. It's not to say it's a bad product, just if I am only using it for one feature, then I grossly overpaid for it. Which is actually why I am eyeballing that EZ-Flash cart.
    Still, a homebrew like this would easily be something I would be using on a regular basis
     
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  16. StarTrekVoyager

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    Actually I personnaly only install CIAs from CDN servers because of this. I'm always afraid that a .3DS from those ISO/Chaos sites could be altered in some ways, because one time I downloaded a SMBDeluxe ROM from that paradise site, and world 8-1 was corrupted.
    Back on topic, well the fact is that Gateway is essentially a 'traditional flashcart' part mixed with a CFW part. Since Luma3DS can do all the CFW things for free, if someone wants the great GW cheat feartures, jhe ends up paying 90 bucks only for this particular feature. Plus Brickway/Brickgate and dat Gatewait meme (yes, we are still waiting for up-to-date features), that ends up discouraging most of people, especially those who don't have access to this amount of money each day (i.e. kids under 18 and people who are kinda poor). And I don't talk about Sky3DS+ because it has very limited features (only clean .3ds, no online, but you can dump PH, but you need a real cart, and you end up paying for pirating which is stupid) for a price above GW's.
     
  17. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    The more I think about it, how does the Wii boot isos? Maybe we can learn from that method and use it here.
     
  18. GerbilSoft

    GerbilSoft GBAtemp Addict

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    cIOS intercepts calls to read raw DVD sectors and replaces them with sectors read from USB/SD. (Wii games can't access the disc drive directly.)

    This *is* doable on 3DS, since ARM11 can't access Slot-1 directly. No one's bothered to do so because the .cia method is already there. It would also require a lot of low-level patching, similar to what cIOSes do.
     
    Last edited by GerbilSoft, Feb 6, 2017 - Reason: +low-level patching
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  19. Lilith Valentine

    Lilith Valentine GBATemp's Wolfdog™ I drool on my knife

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    Interesting and really doesn't sound like something impossible to do. Now we just need to get "There's already CIA's" mentality out of the way and we can start getting a project like this moving.
     
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  20. Sonic Angel Knight

    Sonic Angel Knight GBAtemp Guru

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    @Crystal the Glaceon If i didn't have to buy a flash cart, i would like a .3ds rom loader, mostly cause of the no 300 title limit. :)

    But seem like people are on two sides of the same coin, one with flash carts and one with CFW CIA. Though i didn't know people were like this especially for 3DS. I thought lots of people were happily working together and respect each other opinion and workspace. :(

    Never gonna get some action replay like cheat search creator function on 3DS. :ninja: