15 States are Setting New COVID19 Records. What Do 13 Have in Common?

[Xzi]

This is a question I've been too afraid to ask and I'm not trying to start anything. I only have a high school education in biology, but don't our bodies develop immunities when exposed to viruses? I think it's called active natural immunity but I could be misremembering. Does this just not happen with Covid?

Those who have been infected do develop antibodies, yes, and there have even been some encouraging results with plasma donation from donors with antibodies to recipients currently fighting the virus. What we can't possibly know yet, however, is how long this natural immunity to re-infection will last. Viruses are able to mutate and adapt very quickly, which is why there's a new vaccine shot for the flu every year (and that won't protect you from all existing strains, just the most common ones).

The reasons we can't tell healthy individuals "just intentionally infect yourself so you can develop antibodies" should be obvious though. Even if it doesn't outright kill you it can leave you with potentially permanent damage to various organs. Not to mention that most hospital ICUs are already filled to capacity, so you may not be able to get treatment for severe symptoms at all.

 

[notimp]

I've heard somewhere before, that the answer on that level is pretty much 'we don't know', We dont know what makes some people have almost no symptoms, and some people not produce adequate numbers of antibodies, and some people producing the adequate amounts, but them seemingly not working so well. Also something called a cytokine storm ( e.g. https://theconversation.com/coronav...be-behind-some-fatal-cases-of-covid-19-136878 ) is behind quite a few number of highly problematic outcomes, which is the immune system actually overreacting.

(edit: We dont know on the process level. We know on the statistical level i.e. "because they are old" )

Mortality rate of Covid-19 is at 0.375% roughly - in a western country, with your medical system working as intended. Now that we have newer treatment options, it even might be slightly lower. Or much higher depending on if your hospitals are overtaxed (even in short bursts).

The main issue with Covid-19 is, that no one has had it a while ago, it is transmittable from human to human, and without action like social distancing, the reproduction rate is exponential.

Which all comes down to - main problem being, that hospitals could be seriously overtaxed, if nothing is done, and that we need to buy time to find better treatment options. While propagation isnt slowed down by a 'base resistance level' in populations.

Hence - epidemic.

In previous cases (other SARS viruses f.e.), we just got lucky. (F.e. there was a carrier animal we could eradicate, or it was less contagious, or...) To get a new virus thats able to cause a pandemic a few aspects have to align. (But we are making it more likely by cramming more people into tighter areas. (Not just the propagation even the 'creation' part.))

 

[tatripp]

Nothing to ignore if it isn't true.

Look... Our scientists are (rightfully) warning that the infection rate is resurging again, while our medical personnel warns that we haven't yet have the supplies we've used during the first wave. So we'red certainly not in any safe zone yet. But in actual infection rate? Nope. There's not a single European country (EU or otherwise) that's anywhere even in the area of close to the top of their infection rate. The importance of @ChibiMofo 's most should be that an alarming amount of states have record numbers of cases, NOT whichever fucking politician' s party is leading it.

It looks like you are right. What I read about were spikes in isolated areas. It should be about what is best for the people/country and not about the politicians. That's what I was stating originally.

 

[UltraSUPRA]

Could somebody please watch V for Vendetta?

 

[TheRedfox]

So, how long until ICU/death rate will follow the infection rate?
Would guess 2 weeks myself, but probably the republican supporters know better

I really don't get how a complete country can be ignorant like this, and make a pandemic a political issue

 

[notimp]

Could somebody please watch V for Vendetta?

Done. (Me, this evening.)

 

[notimp]

If anyone is interested in human behavioral aspects during the pandemic:


Havent watched the video yet, but I will. Its Ariely, so its good.

 

[ChibiMofo]

Congrats to Florida, which today broke its own grim record with over 15,000 new cases in one day. Meanwhile its nutcase, Traitor Trump-supporting governor refuses to shut the state down or even mandate wearing masks in public! My god conservatives are breathtakingly ignorant! If you ever wondered just how dumb conservatives are compared to liberals, COVID-19 has given you the definitive answer.

 

[UltraSUPRA]

My god conservatives are breathtakingly ignorant!

Says the guy advocating for communism.

 

[Taleweaver]

Says the guy advocating for communism.

Stop being a sheep and learn what the term means. Your post just illustrates his point.

 

[UltraSUPRA]

Stop being a sheep and learn what the term means. Your post just illustrates his point.

Explain.

 

[MurraySkull]

Congrats to Florida, which today broke its own grim record with over 15,000 new cases in one day. Meanwhile its nutcase, Traitor Trump-supporting governor refuses to shut the state down or even mandate wearing masks in public! My god conservatives are breathtakingly ignorant! If you ever wondered just how dumb conservatives are compared to liberals, COVID-19 has given you the definitive answer.

Also, Trump is NOT a traitor!!!

 

[Taleweaver]

Explain.

I don't believe for a second you'll listen, but ey... You can always prove me wrong.
Anyhow... Communism means a state - lead economy to the degree them owning all possessions.
Doctors and health conglomerates have no political power outside of their medical field. They don't own states, they don't write laws. They bring advices that are based on scientific evidence and predictions based on knowledge about pandemics and disease spreading. But in the end, country leaders take, leave or interpret these advices. Some strict, some less so... And some totally ignore it.

I said before (and say it again) that I don't like further politicizing this pandemic because it always ends up putting blame on a group that'll never respond in a logical fashion but will try to either revert the accusations or blame some third party. It's driving the same people apart that should be working together on a solution.

However, since you want me to explain my post, I've gotta say it : he's at least right in so far that most Republicans follow Trump in his crazy fantasy world that "the others" are to blame (China, democrats, never Trumper... Anyone who ever criticized him for anything, really),and that this blaming should take priority over fixing the country.
That's dumb. Or more accurate : it's a resistance to seeing the reality as it is, which is what the word 'ignorant' really means. It would've been easier if @ChibiMofo was just swearing or calling names, but while that certainly appears so... He's actually described the situation rather well.

I'm sure you disagree, as is your right. But really... At least acknowledge what he wrote before you reply. You clearly let your emotions take the better of you and took something you heard being used as a semi literate swear word ('he's a communist!!!') and wrote it down without understanding that it meant something that doesn't fit @ChibiMofo 's line of thought (at least from this thread and replies) AT All.

So yeah... I called you a sheep.' parrot' would've been a better description because you echoed a phrase without knowing the meaning, but the US curve would've been flattened weeks of not months ago if it were just a few individuals being ignorant. But there are just too many of you who repeat the same pattern of verbally attacking the persons trying to fix this mess without clear reason other than perhaps 'I saw someone else do it'. Hence... You're a sheep in some weird flock of conservative herd.

I'd tell you to learn and adapt, but I'm sure I lost you around sentence two or three, and now you're just brooding how you can get back at me for saying something you don't like.
For what its worth : I'll read your reply. And then add you to my ignore list. We won't be friends,so no loss there...

 

[Viri]

I actually spoke to a girl from Florida a few months ago about Cov19. This was back in April, and I had told her about me being nervous about it. My state of course was getting 1k a day(my useless as fuck Gov did fuck all to protect the elderly, so, despite our cases being lower than California at the time, our deaths were way higher. Fucking useless! Yes, I'm still butt hurt!) Anyway, She laughed, and said it's all fine and dandy! I told her, once Summer comes, I just know your state of Florida is going to get swarmed with cases.

She still does try to flirt with me, I've ghosted her, lol. But that's another story.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

From the start, China got hit really hard in terms of death rate and hospitalizations. The numbers are hidden but hospitals were full and the dead were being incinerated. Nothing like that happened in the US. It's really weird.

I question the amount of people who actually believe in China's numbers. China's numbers are about as believable as Chinese Muslims having a fun time at their new camp!

 

[osaka35]

Not sure how helpful it is to go just by whether someone is dem or republican. There's enough stupid to go around. With this sort of thing, it's important to see the response at all levels, including individual. Not to mention population density. There is a reason why denser cities will be more likely to have outbreaks even with the exact same response as other places.

So the real tell is when less dense places have worse reaction than those places which have a denser population. Or when density is optional (read: the beach/bars/etc). What local actions lead to what results? For instance, protesters wore mask and tried to give each other as much space as they could. Bars and the like had a lot of people without mask, and folks were close and personal, partying. The first didn't really cause much damage, but the second did.

So, gotta look at the individual level, meaning: belief in science (pro-mask) vs belief in personality (anti-mask). Local level, if cities close businesses or provide some sort of guidance or support. As you go up in the food-chain, you look at the same things.

For instance, Alabama was pretty okay for a while. But the beach cities had mayors who were like "bah, who needs mask" and kept everyone open, even as the state was straddling the line between reasonable and insanity. When people started visiting the beaches, they took the virus back with them throughout alabama and it spread pretty fast. Alabama is pretty bad off right now. so is florida. It's pretty straightforward.

No need to blame a party. Blame individuals for their positions and the adherence to politics rather than science and compassion.

 

[Viri]

Not sure how helpful it is to go just by whether someone is dem or republican. There's enough stupid to go around. With this sort of thing, it's important to see the response at all levels, including individual. Not to mention population density. There is a reason why denser cities will be more likely to have outbreaks even with the exact same response as other places.

Pretty much this. In my state, all the cities with Democrat Mayors had way more cases than the cities with Republican Mayors. I still see people walking around my city without a mask on. When we were getting 1k cases a day, I walked by a playground full of children playing, because, no school! I pretty much mumbled to my self "wow, we're fucked!".

 

[UltraSUPRA]

I don't believe for a second you'll listen, but ey... You can always prove me wrong.
Anyhow... Communism means a state - lead economy to the degree them owning all possessions.
Doctors and health conglomerates have no political power outside of their medical field. They don't own states, they don't write laws. They bring advices that are based on scientific evidence and predictions based on knowledge about pandemics and disease spreading. But in the end, country leaders take, leave or interpret these advices. Some strict, some less so... And some totally ignore it.

I said before (and say it again) that I don't like further politicizing this pandemic because it always ends up putting blame on a group that'll never respond in a logical fashion but will try to either revert the accusations or blame some third party. It's driving the same people apart that should be working together on a solution.

However, since you want me to explain my post, I've gotta say it : he's at least right in so far that most Republicans follow Trump in his crazy fantasy world that "the others" are to blame (China, democrats, never Trumper... Anyone who ever criticized him for anything, really),and that this blaming should take priority over fixing the country.
That's dumb. Or more accurate : it's a resistance to seeing the reality as it is, which is what the word 'ignorant' really means. It would've been easier if @ChibiMofo was just swearing or calling names, but while that certainly appears so... He's actually described the situation rather well.

I'm sure you disagree, as is your right. But really... At least acknowledge what he wrote before you reply. You clearly let your emotions take the better of you and took something you heard being used as a semi literate swear word ('he's a communist!!!') and wrote it down without understanding that it meant something that doesn't fit @ChibiMofo 's line of thought (at least from this thread and replies) AT All.

So yeah... I called you a sheep.' parrot' would've been a better description because you echoed a phrase without knowing the meaning, but the US curve would've been flattened weeks of not months ago if it were just a few individuals being ignorant. But there are just too many of you who repeat the same pattern of verbally attacking the persons trying to fix this mess without clear reason other than perhaps 'I saw someone else do it'. Hence... You're a sheep in some weird flock of conservative herd.

I'd tell you to learn and adapt, but I'm sure I lost you around sentence two or three, and now you're just brooding how you can get back at me for saying something you don't like.
For what its worth : I'll read your reply. And then add you to my ignore list. We won't be friends,so no loss there...

Okay, here's the thing.
When I said that ChibiMofo was a communist, I wasn't referring to the Coronavirus. I was referring to the fact that, while Trump could be a better president and perhaps could have handled the Coronavirus issue better, the only other options in November will be commies.
Now if you want to debate capitalism VS. communism, be my guest, but blocking me -- or anyone, for that matter -- is always a terrible idea.

 

[Taleweaver]

Okay, here's the thing.
When I said that ChibiMofo was a communist, I wasn't referring to the Coronavirus. I was referring to the fact that, while Trump could be a better president and perhaps could have handled the Coronavirus issue better, the only other options in November will be commies.
Now if you want to debate capitalism VS. communism, be my guest, but blocking me -- or anyone, for that matter -- is always a terrible idea.

...so you were basically derailing on top of what I accused you. But ey...I've expected a worse reply, so I thank you for this.

Still: "the only other options". Which options are those? I heard that Kanye West joined the race, but IMHO he's just a comedy third option than anything else(1). So it'll be either Trump or Biden. And Biden...let me just leave this here:


I've blabbered about it for some time (this blog post, for example), but the truth is that USA doesn't have a political left. Sanders was about the only real exception to the rule, but even so he's basically aiming to get what has been common good in Europe for some generations now. And even he isn't advocating anything even in the slightest of what I've outlined in the definition of communism (that'd be much more authoritarian policies and some further "degradation" of individual freedom). Joe Biden's about as much a communist as a chimpansee is a flute player.

Anyway...I've made my point. If you don't want to think for yourself as to WHY Biden is portrayed as a communist, that's on you. To me, you're still a sheep herded by fear. I mean...I hear you don't want to vote for Trump but are just too afraid of the alternative. So why would Trump's fan base ever reduce your fear? You might realise that someone who used her private mail server WOULDN'T have been a worse choice over a foul-mouthing, woman-hating, multiple bankrupt media figure with zero political experience. Or that a a vice president whom served the country without a hitch for 8 years wouldn't be a worse choice over the guy who stringed together an amazing amount of scandals in only four years of presidency.

(1): fr this reason, I never bothered checking into his politics. He could be Joseph Lenin "proletarian power" mcMarx for all I know, but still: he doesn't have a chance no matter what he does

 

[notimp]

@Taleweaver: How does that fit into your matrix (2x2 thingy above)?
https://grist.org/politics/the-bide...orce-on-climate-heres-their-new-plan-sunrise/



Never 'trust' matrices like the one above as 'representation of reality', btw. they are just a visualization for a categorization scheme. They might be an interesting visualization (look at the categorization scheme ), but thats all they are.

(None of whats plotted is 'easily measurable'. Hence, probably not hard science.. )

Also, notice the two axis chosen? In terms f.e. individual voting decisions, they could be basically anything. (left/right | likes people/hates em)

Or to put it differently, the first thing the graphs asserts is that there is a categorization scheme 'authoritarian'/'liberal' out there, that people use, or should use to qualify political candidates.

Most people dont. At least not in the 'matter of fact 'ness' of Klobuchar is four units more authoritarian than Booker.

But its a nice graph..