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Leaders blame Russia-Europe pipeline leaks on sabotage (Nord Stream)

Deleted member 114266

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Lol, the sanctions were never tied to oil/gas transactions. Both Europe and the US agreed long ago to remove them entirely if Russia were to end their senseless invasion of Ukraine. Putin seems hellbent on continuing to kneecap his own country, though, despite the fact that everybody else knows he has already lost.
They weren't outright stopped, but there were attempts to drastically cut down on the purchases.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianpal...n-oil-and-gas-didnt-work-and-now-we-know-why/

Europa's reliance on Russian gas and oil were one of the major things keeping the sanctions from having their full effect. Putin turn off the valve on his end to put pressure on Europe, claiming their was necessary maintenance due to leaks. Someone decided to double down for him.
 

Xzi

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No, so far it's been related to the Russian pipeline and surrounding topics like the sanctions.

Let's try to stay some what on topic for once.
Tangentially related, since the sooner the conflict ends, the sooner the sanctions end. Seems like one of the only ways that happens is if Russia runs out of warm bodies to send to Ukraine.
 

LainaGabranth

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It's so frustrating that I've been beating the fucking nuclear drum for years and these animals still fall for the gas meme, not realizing shit like this will continue to happen until the change happens.
 
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sarkwalvein

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It's so frustrating that I've been beating the fucking nuclear drum for years and these animals still fall for the gas meme, not realizing shit like this will continue to happen until the change happens.
Nuclear energy is a very good idea regarding production of energy with a very low impact on the environment. It can also help to avoid dependency on other countries for energy.

But if the topic is about potential damage if sabotage or a direct attack is achieved, then nuclear power plants are a higher risk. Zaporizhzhia has been mentioned quite a bit lately.
 

LainaGabranth

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Nuclear energy is a very good idea regarding production of energy with a very low impact on the environment. It can also help to avoid dependency on other countries for energy.

But if the topic is about potential damage if sabotage or a direct attack is achieved, then nuclear power plants are a higher risk. Zaporizhzhia has been mentioned quite a bit lately.
While true, it's better to have a centralized target than something like a big ass pipeline that you can sabotage. The threat of an international incident from hitting nuclear power plants imo is more discouraging of hapless bombings of civilian areas than pipes getting hit by crossfire or intentional crippling blows.
 

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I honestly wouldn’t be shocked if it was all an accident and human error. It seems like everyone is pushing for it to be more than that do they can use it as justification to go to war
 

sarkwalvein

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I honestly wouldn’t be shocked if it was all an accident and human error. It seems like everyone is pushing for it to be more than that do they can use it as justification to go to war
To be honest I don't see Russia or Germany gaining anything from this, so in any case I don't really think this would be an intentional act committed by any of those two countries. In the other hand I can see incompetence coming from any of those two parties, and from others too.
 

LainaGabranth

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To be honest I don't see Russia or Germany gaining anything from this, so in any case I don't really think this would be an intentional act committed by any of those two countries. In the other hand I can see incompetence coming from any of those two parties, and from others too.
Yeah, the thing this war has shown is that so many sides in it are beyond fucking dumb, and I think that's the real tragedy in this. Millions of lives can easily and irreparably snuffed out for good purely because of the egos and moronic tendencies of tyrant leaders.
 

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To be honest I don't see Russia or Germany gaining anything from this, so in any case I don't really think this would be an intentional act committed by any of those two countries. In the other hand I can see incompetence coming from any of those two parties, and from others too.
I don’t either but seems like everyone involved does have some vested interest in blaming someone else. Maybe it’s not the intention to go to war but there’s definitely an intention to avoid the possibility that it was human error or some non-malicious incident
 

LainaGabranth

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I don’t either but seems like everyone involved does have some vested interest in blaming someone else. Maybe it’s not the intention to go to war but there’s definitely an intention to avoid the possibility that it was human error or some non-malicious incident
With an incident like this no one is going to take responsibility for it anyways, even if forced to. This whole situation just pisses me off.
 

The Catboy

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With an incident like this no one is going to take responsibility for it anyways, even if forced to. This whole situation just pisses me off.
It’s tragic really. This will just be used for political gains and that will hide the truth if it’s ever found.
 

Deleted member 194275

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This is a major roadblock for Russia to bargain back commercial deals with Europe, that is the worst case scenario for USA. Yet... for some reason... people already know that USA has nothing to do with it. Makes sense... USA would never ever do those kind of things, right?

Now Europe is lucky because the USA is so generous that can supply all nations. They will totally not get billions from it, right?
 

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Pff... I'm not going to make myself popular, but so be it.

I think it's the usa's doing. While they pretend to be all for ukraine, they profit hardly less by delivering weapons to Russia. As such, they mostly want a prolonged conflict rather than a resolved one.
Russia is an easy scapegoat with Putin's cloak and dagger techniques. The thing is... He doesn't use these things without reason. The pipe was a strong trump card that he's now lost. Not exactly worth it compared to being able to play the victim(which... Wouldn't work regardless).
Ukraine and Germany i honestly think have their focus elsewhere.

Oh, but there's more... I'm glad they did it. No, i won't be liking it (I've spent 2019's winter largely without heating in Belgium due to home renovation... And that was before our little one was born). But damnit... The EU should be involved in this war. Not this 'we' re supporting ukraine as long as it doesn't cost us' bullshit... Actually involved. And I'd rather be good for some months(I've lived through it) than heating on Russian gas.

I don’t either but seems like everyone involved does have some vested interest in blaming someone else. Maybe it’s not the intention to go to war but there’s definitely an intention to avoid the possibility that it was human error or some non-malicious incident
You don't have to have a vested interest to not wanting to be caught in the act. It's an act of war no matter who did it and for whatever reason.
 

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You don't have to have a vested interest to not wanting to be caught in the act. It's an act of war no matter who did it and for whatever reason.
That’s true as well. I kind of more hope that it was an accident but know that it doesn’t matter
 
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