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California Court SHUTS DOWN Transgender Pronoun Law

tabzer

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What do you gain from distracting trans people? How are trans people wronging you by existing and wanting to be respected? What’s the point in going through all of this when trans people are going to keep going on and living their life with or without your input?

Trans people are not wronging me by existing. I respect people, as people. I don't need to agree with their ideas or lifestyle. I can have an opinion about it without being afraid of it. In fact, I have a strong position due to my attempts to understand. Calling me "transphobic" is just a bypass to confronting uncomfortable (differing) points of view. You don't want to admit that I have said anything valid, so you just call it your flavor of evil, and dismiss it without thinking about it, because "being mindless is fun and liberating".

eliminating them by force for the former, eating them for the latter (literally or metaphorically, your choice).

Balance is tricky, because you risk becoming the thing you swore to be against.
 

The Catboy

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Trans people are not wronging me by existing. I respect people, as people. I don't need to agree with their ideas or lifestyle. I can have an opinion about it without being afraid of it. In fact, I have a strong position due to my attempts to understand. Calling me "transphobic" is just a bypass to confronting uncomfortable (differing) points of view. You don't want to admit that I have said anything valid, so you just call it your flavor of evil, and dismiss it without thinking about it, because "being mindless is fun and liberating".
Because you don’t actually have anything valid to say. You can’t just “disagree” with someone’s existence and expect that to be treated the same way as disagreeing if pineapple should go on pizza or not. Trans people exists, countless studies, medical, psychology, and so much more proves trans people exist. There’s also plenty of evidence that shows that respecting the identity of trans people is one of the best things people can do. Acting like “disagreeing” with trans people is something that should be respect is the same as acting like someone “disagreeing” with existence of someone’s race or skin color. It’s just as uncontrollable a factor and just as wrong to disgree with.
 
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Xzi

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Balance is tricky, because you risk becoming the thing you swore to be against.
It's not tricky at all, as this only applies to those two groups exclusively. Very few people will own up to being fascist, even when pushed; and billionaires make sure to avoid us "unwashed masses" as much as possible.
 

tabzer

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Because you don’t actually have anything valid to say. You can’t just “disagree” with someone’s existence and expect that to be treated the same way as disagreeing if pineapple should go on pizza or not. Trans people exists, countless studies, medical, psychology, and so much more proves trans people exist. There’s also plenty of evidence that respecting the identity of trans people is one of the best things people can do. Acting like “disagreeing” with trans people is something that should be respected is asking the same as respecting someone “disagreeing” with existence of someone’s race or skin color. It’s just as uncontrollable a factor and just as wrong to disgree with.

If you think that being trans comes before being human, then I think there is something wrong with your priorities. If you think being trans is in your DNA, then congrats, you are hardcore. Me disagreeing with someone about what kind of life is the best life, or most sincere life, is not me disagreeing with their existence. It's me, being a different existence.

Maybe you truly are tabzerphobic afterall. You think you are the *underepresented minority. Hah.

It's not tricky at all, as this only applies to those two groups exclusively. Very few people will own up to being fascist, even when pushed; and billionaires make sure to avoid us "unwashed masses" as much as possible.

Well, should I take your denial as evidence of which category you want to be in the most?
 
Last edited by tabzer,

linuxares

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All of you who are having a discussion whatever if Transgender is a mental disorder or not, are both wrong and right.
It's still not clear why some people are trans and why some aren't. Some say it's a mental disorder some say it's by "culture" etc.

So just drop it already. When people that are smarter than you that works in this field can't figure it out, it's probably not going to be solved on a GBAtemp post.
 

Skelletonike

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Damn, I need to stop checking these threads. They start interesting but then they go to shit.

Anyway, it's a good thing that they shut down such a law, while I do believe people should respect each other, forcing someone to use pronouns they may not even now is just wrong.

It's hard to guess what people want to be called and unless you know the person, it's just not feasible. In case you do know them, well, it's different.

For example, at work I get a lot of calls, people tell me their name and I just call them by whatever name they give me.
 

tabzer

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All of you who are having a discussion whatever if Transgender is a mental disorder or not, are both wrong and right.
It's still not clear why some people are trans and why some aren't. Some say it's a mental disorder some say it's by "culture" etc.

So just drop it already. When people that are smarter than you that works in this field can't figure it out, it's probably not going to be solved on a GBAtemp post.


Since you responded in a way that seemed to be perturbed, I assume it is because people were zealously hitting the report button over things that they disagree with.

Because you added this to the discussion, one that I was compelled to participate in--out of risk of forfeiting my own representation (thanks @Lacius), I'm going to carry.

First, I don't think anyone is attempting to solve anything. I think people want to challenge/change the colloquial understanding, and are willing to sacrifice any remaining trace of social dignity for the sake of feeling like "at least I fought for what I believe in". Some people "fake it until you make it", and are trying to "be the change that they want to see in the world". Some people want to accurately understand/describe how the world actually is. I see both states of mind to often be at odds with each other.

Second, "transgender" is defined as "denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender does not correspond with their birth sex." That's a pitiful definition, as it's not just their "birth sex", it's their sex, period. Even if they get artificial genitalia and hormone supplements (injections), they are still genetically what they are. People who don't identify with themselves are going to have a clear disadvantage in identifying with other people. They will identify with ideas that other people, like them, identify with--but they will be at odds with their body. If such a person cannot represent their own body faithfully, who is to say or suggest that they could represent any body?

Whether that is an advantage or disadvantage, is really up to their personal experience and outcome. Not all transgender people think the same, and not all want to be addressed by a specific pronoun. Some are actually smarter than people posting on GBAtemp and twitter.

Third. Consider that the word 'disorder' is exactly what it suggests. A disorder is anything that departs from the expected norm. Calling things mental disorders is a lack of understanding of the situation. Perhaps the norm caused these "disorders" in the first place.
 
Last edited by tabzer,

linuxares

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Since you responded in a way that seemed to be perturbed, I assume it is because people were zealously hitting the report button over things that they disagree with
Nay, I were reading the topic and replied. Please don't assume how we moderate.
 

RichardTheKing

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Such "rules" are dumb and illogical - if you don't know someone, how the hell are you supposed to know what pronouns they prefer? We can't read minds!
Not to mention how easy it is to have a memory lapse and forget about preferred pronouns every now and then, until you're friends with the person in question.

They made the only logical choice here.
 

Mollycule

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You can always put in a little effort just to be decent!

If in doubt, you can still be respectful to your fellow human beings without "having to remember or assume" all this confusing metadata about other humans.
 

DBlaze

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I have more important things to worry about than thinking about what pronoun to use for someone I don't know.
Let's just start using XX and XY, good luck denying chromosomes.

rare cases being the exception ofcourse
 
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Deleted member 194275

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You can always put in a little effort just to be decent!

If in doubt, you can still be respectful to your fellow human beings without "having to remember or assume" all this confusing metadata about other humans.

Look, I'm all for people be called in a way they fell comfortable. But please understand that for languages without widespread neutral pronouns it is freaking hard to go without doing mistakes. Lantin based languages (Portuguese, Spanish, French, Italian and others) speakers will do this mistake online, the context will tell you if is intentional or not, many times will be not intentional. I did the mistake to use he/she where I had to use they, and It was not intentional at all.
 

subcon959

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You can always put in a little effort just to be decent!

If in doubt, you can still be respectful to your fellow human beings without "having to remember or assume" all this confusing metadata about other humans.
Good example, but it only applies to people with a certain grasp of English. In fact, this topic in general seems to be alienating to non-English speakers.
 

SyphenFreht

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Wow. 12 pages of conservatives whining about a law that has very little, if at all, to do with them.

It's funny how the first thing people focus on is their freedom of speech as opposed to the gross medical misconduct that could arise from not calling someone what they wish to be called, especially in regards to procedures that may require a professional to know their biological history. If old Mr. Jenkins isn't doing too well and becomes unresponsive due to a medical situation, wouldn't it be pertinent for the people who work around him need to be aware of, and comply with, something as simple as acknowledging his Trans status in terms of medical related questioning and having to run tests to determine a diagnosis?

Oh, wait. That's a scenario people don't care about because it imparts on their ability to be discourteous and self absorbed.

"BUT, BUT, people need their free speech! "

Except, you still have your free speech. Prolonged usage of such language that belittles them comes with a price. It's the same basic logic as calling someone the n-word or the ch-word or the sp-word over and over again. Technically, you have your free speech, you just don't have your freedom of repercussions, which many people (conservatives and liberals alike!) don't seem to grasp.

TL;DR?

California lawmakers shot down a law that attempted to ease the integration of a growing community of Trans people who want to be treated like people.

No wonder all the other countries make fun of us
 

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