I really doubt most gamers are liberal. Or at least I don't believe they're an overwhelming majority. The ones who aren't often just refrain from saying they aren't since doing so can often be social suicide due to how crazies react.
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I think there is a good mix of all kinds of people since gaming is so mainstream now. Myself, I'm a borderline anarchist; I guess you'd say minarchist or Libertarian but with even less government oversight. From where I sit on the spectrum, it's equally amusing and frustrating to see the left-leaning games media and many developers/publishers alienating their more right-leaning customer base and then blaming poor sales on patriarchy, misogyny, or any of the various "phobias" that get thrown around and have no meaning anymore. I often find myself not-so-secretly hoping for the entire industry to become unsustainable and to come crashing down. My philosophy is that it's best to keep politics and religion separate from business in order to avoid annoying large portions of your customer base, but what do I know?
One oddity I noticed based on the forums of a certain private gaming torrent tracker is that many of the users are both pro-police and pro-social justice, which is just strange considering it's a community based around stealing games.
One of the subjects that often comes up is the portrayal of sex and sexuality and the appearance of women in games. Now, one would think a liberal community would be more open to these ideas, but the consensus seems to be that sexy women in games = bad and sexuality is generally frowned upon, lumping them all together as japanese loli rape hentai games, when that couldn't be further from the truth. It's perfectly fine to show caricatures of musclebound manly men, but Christ forbid we show a woman with anything bigger than a C cup or a little bit of skin. That would be misogyny and objectification! Outrage culture, no matter which side they claim to represent, is a hindrance to society and needs to end.
One oddity I noticed based on the forums of a certain private gaming torrent tracker is that many of the users are both pro-police and pro-social justice, which is just strange considering it's a community based around stealing games.
One of the subjects that often comes up is the portrayal of sex and sexuality and the appearance of women in games. Now, one would think a liberal community would be more open to these ideas, but the consensus seems to be that sexy women in games = bad and sexuality is generally frowned upon, lumping them all together as japanese loli rape hentai games, when that couldn't be further from the truth. It's perfectly fine to show caricatures of musclebound manly men, but Christ forbid we show a woman with anything bigger than a C cup or a little bit of skin. That would be misogyny and objectification! Outrage culture, no matter which side they claim to represent, is a hindrance to society and needs to end.
Entirely bullsh*tt non argument and 'I'm a victim narrative' from a former staff member no less. You can litterally say anything in forums these days, if you just add 'I feel'.
And people will cheer for your standpoint. Because you feel so pretty. Thats the times we are living in.
Racist, homophobic stuff, outright lies. Conspiracy theories, that arent even fun, and bare no resemblance to reality. This forum alone is hard on the edge of being a shere dumpster fire, where a few people still try to move some of the ideologic lies that fuel it - out of 'well, I guess thats what most people say, so it must be true' range.
I hate your statement - do you understand that?
To have anything of substance with your 'emotional - we so victims' - you have to give examples. Not sentiments. If you give none - and pronounce yourself - or anyone who wants to feel that way a victim - you are manipulative and nothing else.
Give examples - we could look at and at least discuss - and your sentiment may be fine - give none, and you are literally engaging in the worst form of propaganda there is. Its all emotion, nothing else, right.
F*ck.
And please remove yourself from the discussion, if thats your input.
"But I feel.."
And that may be all you are doing - you feel your reality - you dont use your brain even once. And thats a problem. Liberal, conservative, doesnt matter here.
What makes this worse, is that you get likes here just because of status (your forum badge). Thats another issue. So you hide behind status symbols and feels. And talk to an impressionable young audience - spreading victim narratives. Get out.
Last edited by notimp,
I feel that most gamers are liberal. Wrong.
I feel that this is a grave injustice. Even if it were true: Wrong.
I feel that the reasons for this view have to be discussed, but somewhere in the realm of 'its all the others fault'.
Why am I always the victim? Wrong.
Do you want a big picture view of whats happening here? Again?
Young people growing up in an instagram world want something to rebel against, but also be 'cool'. Cool now is what gets most likes and followers (completely wrong as a concept), so you now have to rebell by being against a grave injustice that is also so blasé that everyone can kind of agree to your cause of 'trying to be different, but cool'.
So you start SJW stuff, where you fight for the rights of minorities, that are so small as a group, that not many people in the real world 'care' either way. And because you dont get any pushback all your stances tend to end up on the extreme end of the spectrum, while at the same time you convince yourselves, that your view is beyond criticism - because you are doing gods wok. Now how about that as youth culture. If you want to optimize for more followers - you rephrase some of the more radical statements, because people dont like stances that are too radical - but again, that already gets offset by 'nobody really cares' about that stuff in the first place - so there is even room to be radical and 'cute'. or radical and 'figthting the good fight' - and getting all them instagram lkes - because the issues are so small (only in terms of people affected, not feels).
Gamers are still pretty much a 'low life subculture' in the public eye - which also has to do with the way gaming was pushed into the mainstream. I mean, you cant sucessfully argue, that games are art, and at the same time defund all 'critics' and and create a fluffer culture with youtubers and streamers that talk about the most popular sh*t without any artistic integrity or deeper meaning, for living. Fortnight. So lets say that was marketings fault, you all were victims - and move on.
Because Gamers don't matter at all in the public eye (you are not cool, you are not happening, you are not sexy, you are not important, you are living a virtual life) - they are now also being able to be denounced as a subgroup. Some feminists, for whatever reason picked you out as a main field for criticism. Because its an easy target. Feminism fighting against the subgroup of historically non feminist cultural expression, where they are most likely to get likes for what they are doing. Hating on gamers for gender discrimination is born. Mainstream likes it, because it really changes nothing (they hated gamers for shooting all the schoolchildren) - hence - here are your likes.
The biggest issue here is, that you are tackling predominantly male - youth identity - by ramping up insecurities through the roof - in the current feminists hating on gamers climate. Again - would you please challenge actual societal role models first? Too hard? Too few likes in that?
When you hear a gamer pleading that he please wants his sixties styles sexualized iconography back - chances are, that he's not the bad boy objectifying women in the real world, sisters. ('But all objectification is wrong, and this gives me most likes!' Says the self optimizing feminist. 'Could I make a living by counting female protagonists in videogames?' she asks herself. And society loves it - because it only addresses issues with 'tha gaming folk' which is of no importance to them at all.)
Here are the arguments on the other side that have something to it in my mind. With people drawing all their self worth out of WORTHLESS gamification tickers, that are only there so you watch all the advertisement space - cultures have to become more inclusive - or else those small minorities either don't participate in those 'societal games', or get singled out and depressed even more. Theres something to that. But only if you accept, that everybody has to have 2000 followers to be happy or be considered 'of any societal importance'.
There are dumb fucks out there in elitist meetings, that do exactly that. Shut those down first, if you want to change any of it.
(see: https://www.apa-ots-video.at/video/5333013067a14a6eb3013067a17a6ef3 )
The joke about all of this is - that it is entirely compatible to mainstream cultural interests, and would not change anything politically - economically, in any meaningfull way. So advertising money is on board, and you get most likes and followernumbers.
Then there is racism. Which is exactly the same (intrinsic feels based motivation, getting gamified (likes, followernumbers)), but without the advertising money. Racism even became mainstream.
So is all that the fault of 'liberals' - i dont think so. But I know for fact, that bubbles - which is what you are building that way, lead to the propagation of more extreme, more uninformed opinions. Which then tend to clash. The accepted way out of it currently is to become youtuber/twich streamer - and fake like everything - and be fake disturbed by everything that isnt trending. Self optimize. Thats the current societal answer to bubbles. (Discussions never could take place in social media - because the format was: Load off your emotions in a response in and ever scroling feed. (Youtube comments people culture. But everywhere.) - and now we are transitioning to more regional bubbles (whatsapp fried circles) as a way out of it. Thats also compatible with the nationalist revival. Horray for advertising money.)
Lets face it 90% of you have never learned how to engage in an argument, without trying to ruin the other persons public image. Collectively, you are uneducated, gamified, angry, and entirely convinced, that it is the fault of the other side - just not the social media system you are all participating in willingly - every day.
Any takers on that?
Also - any takers on you all only post variants of "why is my position better than yours?" or "isn't it unfair, that my position isnt better than yours" as topics - because you all learned, collectively, that this is whats popular, and popular is important.
This thread - entirely popular - and until now, hasnt really produced much of intellectually stimulating thought. But you had 100 takers, that offered you their feels in what substitutes discussion today.
I feel that this is a grave injustice. Even if it were true: Wrong.
I feel that the reasons for this view have to be discussed, but somewhere in the realm of 'its all the others fault'.
Why am I always the victim? Wrong.
Do you want a big picture view of whats happening here? Again?
Young people growing up in an instagram world want something to rebel against, but also be 'cool'. Cool now is what gets most likes and followers (completely wrong as a concept), so you now have to rebell by being against a grave injustice that is also so blasé that everyone can kind of agree to your cause of 'trying to be different, but cool'.
So you start SJW stuff, where you fight for the rights of minorities, that are so small as a group, that not many people in the real world 'care' either way. And because you dont get any pushback all your stances tend to end up on the extreme end of the spectrum, while at the same time you convince yourselves, that your view is beyond criticism - because you are doing gods wok. Now how about that as youth culture. If you want to optimize for more followers - you rephrase some of the more radical statements, because people dont like stances that are too radical - but again, that already gets offset by 'nobody really cares' about that stuff in the first place - so there is even room to be radical and 'cute'. or radical and 'figthting the good fight' - and getting all them instagram lkes - because the issues are so small (only in terms of people affected, not feels).
Gamers are still pretty much a 'low life subculture' in the public eye - which also has to do with the way gaming was pushed into the mainstream. I mean, you cant sucessfully argue, that games are art, and at the same time defund all 'critics' and and create a fluffer culture with youtubers and streamers that talk about the most popular sh*t without any artistic integrity or deeper meaning, for living. Fortnight. So lets say that was marketings fault, you all were victims - and move on.
Because Gamers don't matter at all in the public eye (you are not cool, you are not happening, you are not sexy, you are not important, you are living a virtual life) - they are now also being able to be denounced as a subgroup. Some feminists, for whatever reason picked you out as a main field for criticism. Because its an easy target. Feminism fighting against the subgroup of historically non feminist cultural expression, where they are most likely to get likes for what they are doing. Hating on gamers for gender discrimination is born. Mainstream likes it, because it really changes nothing (they hated gamers for shooting all the schoolchildren) - hence - here are your likes.
The biggest issue here is, that you are tackling predominantly male - youth identity - by ramping up insecurities through the roof - in the current feminists hating on gamers climate. Again - would you please challenge actual societal role models first? Too hard? Too few likes in that?
When you hear a gamer pleading that he please wants his sixties styles sexualized iconography back - chances are, that he's not the bad boy objectifying women in the real world, sisters. ('But all objectification is wrong, and this gives me most likes!' Says the self optimizing feminist. 'Could I make a living by counting female protagonists in videogames?' she asks herself. And society loves it - because it only addresses issues with 'tha gaming folk' which is of no importance to them at all.)
Here are the arguments on the other side that have something to it in my mind. With people drawing all their self worth out of WORTHLESS gamification tickers, that are only there so you watch all the advertisement space - cultures have to become more inclusive - or else those small minorities either don't participate in those 'societal games', or get singled out and depressed even more. Theres something to that. But only if you accept, that everybody has to have 2000 followers to be happy or be considered 'of any societal importance'.
There are dumb fucks out there in elitist meetings, that do exactly that. Shut those down first, if you want to change any of it.
(see: https://www.apa-ots-video.at/video/5333013067a14a6eb3013067a17a6ef3 )
The joke about all of this is - that it is entirely compatible to mainstream cultural interests, and would not change anything politically - economically, in any meaningfull way. So advertising money is on board, and you get most likes and followernumbers.
Then there is racism. Which is exactly the same (intrinsic feels based motivation, getting gamified (likes, followernumbers)), but without the advertising money. Racism even became mainstream.
So is all that the fault of 'liberals' - i dont think so. But I know for fact, that bubbles - which is what you are building that way, lead to the propagation of more extreme, more uninformed opinions. Which then tend to clash. The accepted way out of it currently is to become youtuber/twich streamer - and fake like everything - and be fake disturbed by everything that isnt trending. Self optimize. Thats the current societal answer to bubbles. (Discussions never could take place in social media - because the format was: Load off your emotions in a response in and ever scroling feed. (Youtube comments people culture. But everywhere.) - and now we are transitioning to more regional bubbles (whatsapp fried circles) as a way out of it. Thats also compatible with the nationalist revival. Horray for advertising money.)
Lets face it 90% of you have never learned how to engage in an argument, without trying to ruin the other persons public image. Collectively, you are uneducated, gamified, angry, and entirely convinced, that it is the fault of the other side - just not the social media system you are all participating in willingly - every day.
Any takers on that?
Also - any takers on you all only post variants of "why is my position better than yours?" or "isn't it unfair, that my position isnt better than yours" as topics - because you all learned, collectively, that this is whats popular, and popular is important.
This thread - entirely popular - and until now, hasnt really produced much of intellectually stimulating thought. But you had 100 takers, that offered you their feels in what substitutes discussion today.
Last edited by notimp,
D
Deleted User
Guest
OP
I've noticed that some people here are pulling dirt on others. Rather than focusing on the actual argument. (not going expand on that. it's just a statement)
Anyways So let's ask a question. Does it really matter that much about the political spectrum in a video game to the point that it ruins it for you because others in the opposite party you may talk to or end up playing with? I know a few people who are conservative. And honestly I don't care. As long as they don't do or support something that is clearly wrong. such as the supposed concentration camps at the borders which I'm iffy about. However can see why it could be possible due the fact trump is well... Trump.
But if it is true, and they support treating people like that (if they are asylums seekers) then no. I would tell them it's fucking inhuman and that is a horrible point of view to have. But I would never wish the person to be dead or something along the lines of go die. Because then, well... that would make me inhuman to some extent.
Anyways So let's ask a question. Does it really matter that much about the political spectrum in a video game to the point that it ruins it for you because others in the opposite party you may talk to or end up playing with? I know a few people who are conservative. And honestly I don't care. As long as they don't do or support something that is clearly wrong. such as the supposed concentration camps at the borders which I'm iffy about. However can see why it could be possible due the fact trump is well... Trump.
But if it is true, and they support treating people like that (if they are asylums seekers) then no. I would tell them it's fucking inhuman and that is a horrible point of view to have. But I would never wish the person to be dead or something along the lines of go die. Because then, well... that would make me inhuman to some extent.
Last edited by ,
Argument for 'why poilitcs dont matter'.
But then you need "vote or die" campaigns to even get people to the polls. (US is a country with a voter turnout so low - that democracy arguably doesnt work in concept anymore. You have to substitute 'but most people are happy - otherwise they'd vote' to even have it work argumentatively.)
What your argument does is arguing for "everyone just calm down - and ignore stuff", which also doesnt help.
No - the actual issue here is, that people have never learned how to hold proper discussions - and want to win anything on 'how it makes them feel emotionally - when they are confronted with a view" these days.
In fact - isn't that the premise of popular TV formats like 'The View'? So for all the young folks out there - the idea, might be a little bit older... (Much older, in fact.)
Fluffy , flowers, and ignore - is exactly not whats needed. We can live without PC culture for a while - wile trying to identify problems.
PC culture is ignoring issues - with the addition of having the out of telling everyone, that you couldnt do anything about them, because no one told you. (Because you ignored everything that wasnt presented PC.)
"But why are so many people not agreeing with me - should I look for a different hobby?" is a problem. If people start to believe, that this is really a valuable mindset to have.
If you define your position as valuable, or even correct - because of what popularity numbers it can draw - you have become a Borg.(A drone.)
And yes, that is a comment thats personal and directed at the thread starter.
Last edited by notimp,
Why Liberals and Atheists are More Intelligent
Science: Are gamers smarter than non-gamers? (spoiler: research shows they are)
Gamers are therefore more likely to be liberal than the average individual.
Science: Are gamers smarter than non-gamers? (spoiler: research shows they are)
Gamers are therefore more likely to be liberal than the average individual.
Last edited by galneon,
D
Deleted-401606
Guest
OP
No. YOU can say whatever you want because you are a liberal and you go with the flow of the forum. Look how disrespectful you are being to a former staff member that poured hours upon hours into the community. What have you done here besides troll? I reiterate, if you were a conservative you would have been perma banned from this forum a long time ago.
To break it down further. You being outraged, that there is a Anita Sarkeesian, or that the Verge's Gaming podcast crew uses 'inclusive wording' that makes me do doubletakes - if english language really has changed so much in only five years' - might not matter at all societally - for at least the next 40 years.
This doesnt allow you to be racist in return, or try to convince people - why the scientific majority opinion on climate change is fake.
So if you do - and you get pushback. Dont try to hide behind 'we always so victimized". Just because you learned that from SJWs.
Controversial? True?
Thought provoking?
And no - you are not into videogames, because 'peoples what is best?' opinion on 'what is best political fraction' agrees with yours.
You'll realize that right after you have realized, that you are not into videogames, because Sony, MS, or Ninty are the bestest companies. I know it takes time. But the intellectual payoff once you do, I tell you - is really worth it.
This doesnt allow you to be racist in return, or try to convince people - why the scientific majority opinion on climate change is fake.
So if you do - and you get pushback. Dont try to hide behind 'we always so victimized". Just because you learned that from SJWs.
Controversial? True?
Thought provoking?
And no - you are not into videogames, because 'peoples what is best?' opinion on 'what is best political fraction' agrees with yours.
You'll realize that right after you have realized, that you are not into videogames, because Sony, MS, or Ninty are the bestest companies. I know it takes time. But the intellectual payoff once you do, I tell you - is really worth it.
Last edited by notimp,
You do realize we can sense the darkness in you, right? Conservative political beliefs routinely accompany an array of other undesirable traits which make most of you quite easy to spot.
D
Deleted-401606
Guest
OP
Liberal beliefs accompany an array of undesirable traits. Everyone here thinks they are a genius because they are liberal even though it get force fed down your throat by the state ran education system. 99% of celebrities are liberals, if your beliefs are the same as celebrities there is something seriously wrong with what you hold important in life. Being a drone that doesn't question what they are taught doesn't make an individual unique or intelligent.
D
Deleted User
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OP
"Everyone here" I'll stop you right there. The moment you try to lump every single person invalidates a portion of your argument, especially when you consider people who don't view themselves as all that smart. Key example is actually myself. I get told by people around me that I'm smart, but I don't think that I am. There isn't anything that makes me think I am unique or have a ace up my sleeve or some form of anything that screams I'm a genius.
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Deleted-401606
Guest
OP
Why didn't you quote the other guy? I quoted part of his post where he says that being a conservative makes you an unworthy person and I switched the word conservative with liberal. Why don't you quote all the other people on here that are calling people stupid and blatantly attacking others including a former staff member?
Also, didn't you delete one of your post a week ago in effort to avoid a ban because you lost control of your temper and resorted to an ad hominem attack?
D
Deleted User
Guest
OP
I agree. Didn't mean to come out as PC culture or ignore things. That's not what I was aiming, censorship shouldn't be a thing, regardless of material. But yeah, the biggest issue (and partially why I brought up the whole thing about "dirt") is people try digging dirt (for lack of a better word) to then try to say they are wrong. When that dirt is not relevant to the argument in a fashion that moves it forward. (in other words when arugments are brought, people attack the person instead of the person attacking the arguments. Arguments should be held by a case by case basis)
I Believe your mixing me for someone else.
As for "attacking" you. I don't really feel like quoting every instance where someone does that, if I quote you, any material that is similar or targets similar material should be applied.
which yes is my fault for not making that clear
Last edited by ,
I was raised in a religious, conservative household in a deep red state, forced to attend religious schools until I was 18 (all but my elementary school taught that evolution was a myth), was ostracized from my family, for a time, after confessing my atheism at the same age, finished university in the same state where, to my consternation, I had the pleasure of not a single outwardly liberal professor, and now live in the rural south where I know not a single liberal within a 15 mile radius of my house.
But okay, you're right... The liberal education system made me a mindless drone obsessed with things like truth, decency, and the rule of law. I'd warn that the next thing you can expect is us to take to the streets in jackboots, but your side already claimed that gimmick.
D
Deleted-401606
Guest
OP
You can look at the statistics and you will see that in most colleges the professors are indeed liberal. Explain why hollywood pushes a liberal narrative? Why are blacks over represented in Hollywood when we have a higher percentage of Latinos in the country? Why is hollywood liberal? Why is racial diversity in movies only geared towards African Americans not towards Asian Americans or Latinos? Why are the doctors in Tv Series always White and Black when in real life they are of Indian or East Asian decent? Are you really pretending like there isn't an agenda going on here?
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I never said you "attacked" me so why is that in quotations? I just said on a separate thread I saw that you made a post on a different thread that you decided to delete 10 minutes after you posted it.
Lol at "the other side is nazis". Also, while Christianity is ironic and tragic, atheism is a complete joke.
No--"the other side has a white nationalism/domestic terrorism problem."
But please, tell us how atheism is a joke.
Did you not see the research I linked? Liberalism correlates with greater intelligence and a more advanced education. There are more liberal professors because there are more liberal PhDs, not something I'm ashamed to admit. I'm sure I had many liberal professors. They didn't share their views. The Kevin Sorbo professor is a myth, contrary to what Christian bigots preach to the people they want to feel enraged and victimized.
So many false premises in the rest of what you wrote. I'm guessing you haven't seen a doctor television series in the last ten years.
Last edited by galneon,
Pretending you aren't racist by proactively calling the opposing viewpoint racist. That's classic projection.
Atheism is a big joke. It's like a making a foundation on invalidity. It's the religion of the edgelord.
Last edited by tabzer,
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