3DS firmware 11.8 potentially brings the Switch's method of piracy detection

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Looks like this is it. According to a tweet from SciresM, the latest 3DS firmware update 11.8 has ported the Nintendo Switch's piracy detection systems to the console. This strategy enables Nintendo to perfectly distinguish pirated and legit games going online and has been used before to detect and ban pirates on Switch. This is not something that can be avoided with homebrew. According to SciresM, Nintendo hasn't acted on 3DS pirates yet, but can choose to do so any time in the future.

Be careful, guys.

 

TankedThomas

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So basically...you hate everything?

Cool.
No, and I absolutely loathe other people putting words in my mouth. What I hate is the ultimate culmination of where consumerism and capitalism lead in our modern world - not because they're inherently bad systems but that by their very nature, there will be people who exploit those systems to get ahead, and those people tend to be big companies - the ones you'll often be buying from. But this isn't the place for a long philosophical debate. The point is that anti-consumer practises are all too common these days, and when even EA is doing certain things better than Nintendo (refund policies - if you want to know more, go read up on Nintendo basically telling the EU to shove it when asked to introduce mandatory refunds to comply with EU law), you can bet they're far from my favourite company.
SciresM's tweet was misleading. The check only happens when installing a title using the 3DS' built in content installer service, NIM (source 1 source 2 source 3).

Installing and going online with titles installed through FBI or similar are safe. Downloading games through something like Villain3DS is safe (but will probably break real soon when 11.8 is enforced and a valid ticket is REQUIRED to get content from CDN). You can still safely source your CIAs from whatever naughty iso site.

Basically, freeshop can get you banned in its current form (it can be updated to stop using the NIM service, but again, it will probably stop functioning like other CDN downloaders).
Thanks for the reply. That's what I assumed but I'm no expert so I didn't want to jump to conclusions since there's always a lot of that and it just spreads misinformation.

Hopefully then, that means homebrew is completely unaffected. I was worried about patched games too, since plenty of those aren't LayeredFS-compatible (at least, most of them aren't out-of-the-box), which would really suck for things such as fan translations.

The one thing I haven't seen clarified is whether or not the update is required to make freeShop unsafe. I'm assuming not, since it sounds like it'd be a server-side update and the 11.8 update just coincides with it... but I could be wrong.
Well, you gotta ask yourself why they would bother with updating an EOL console.

Lets say you're 11 years old, you play pokemon online and you've managed to get CFW on your 3DS, then your 3DS gets banned from online services and there's not much you can do. Would you be tempted to buy a new 3ds or just to buy a switch where there's promise of new pokemon games coming out soon?

Also it would be interesting to see what games are the most played online games on 3DS. I would imagine Pokemon and Mario Kart. Hopefully not many play Smash online, since from my experience that's a complete lagfest. Btw the 3ds is so easily hackable now that an 8year old could probably do it.
This is true, but my theory is that they updated it now because they only recently figured out how to do this. Seriously, consider this: if they could prevent piracy in this manner for all these years, why take this long to implement it, when the bulk of the sales will be unaffected at this point since very few new 3DS games are still being released? Considering the Switch firmware is somewhat built on the 3DS firmware and considering it only released last year, I have a feeling that they basically found a way to code it for the Switch, then ported what code they could back to the 3DS.
Which is to say that the only reason they're doing it now is because they can. I don't really think it's to help Switch sales (as if they need it). But then again, I'm convinced the guys working at Nintendo are literally insane because very few of their decisions make any logical sense, so you may be completely correct about their reasoning.
 
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ClassyDragon

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My real concern is that it will turn into something more than a seed ban at this stage. I'm already affected by that, but if it turned into an account ban which also affected the Switch, which I idiotically have linked with the same account, I'd be pretty fucked.
I doubt they would do anything like this. Imagine if you were a 3DS owner who sold their 3ds to someone who then hacked it. Later you buy a Switch and use your same account. It would look pretty bad on Nintendo to ban someone who had no control over the use of their previous system they had sold.
 

TankedThomas

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A shame I can't use freeShop any more though, because I used it for - of all things - downloading updates. Nintendo has this ass-backwards design for updates where some games in Australia/NZ are released with a different region code to games release in the UK and Europe. They're still region-compatible, but the updates are not. So, if I import a game from the UK (and I often do, since it's way cheaper), it'll just keep trying to download the update for the ANZ version instead, saying that an update is still available. Highly annoying that Nintendo even does that to begin with.
I doubt they would do anything like this. Imagine if you were a 3DS owner who sold their 3ds to someone who then hacked it. Later you buy a Switch and use your same account. It would look pretty bad on Nintendo to ban someone who had no control over the use of their previous system they had sold.
Apologies if I'm not following what you're saying at almost 7am over here but if that happened, wouldn't it mean you left your NNID linked to your 3DS when you sold it? In which case, you made a dumb mistake (and/or you're an idiot), so Nintendo can't really be held accountable for that.
 

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A shame I can't use freeShop any more though, because I used it for - of all things - downloading updates. Nintendo has this ass-backwards design for updates where some games in Australia/NZ are released with a different region code to games release in the UK and Europe. They're still region-compatible, but the updates are not. So, if I import a game from the UK (and I often do, since it's way cheaper), it'll just keep trying to download the update for the ANZ version instead, saying that an update is still available. Highly annoying that Nintendo even does that to begin with.

Apologies if I'm not following what you're saying at almost 7am over here but if that happened, wouldn't it mean you left your NNID linked to your 3DS when you sold it? In which case, you made a dumb mistake (and/or you're an idiot), so Nintendo can't really be held accountable for that.
According to Nintendo's support forums, a NNID is permanently linked to the 3DS it is created on (unless you do a system transfer), meaning most legit users have no way of removing it. It's perfectly reasonable that someone would be upset getting an account ban based on this.
 

TankedThomas

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According to Nintendo's support forums, a NNID is permanently linked to the 3DS it is created on (unless you do a system transfer), meaning most legit users have no way of removing it. It's perfectly reasonable that someone would be upset getting an account ban based on this.
Oh, right, that. No, if you do a full format, it'll also unlink the NNID. It'd be pretty stupid if you couldn't unlink it before giving it to someone else! Then again, it is Nintendo we're talking about...

By the way, something I came across just now in the freeShop thread: https://gbatemp.net/threads/release...eshop-alternative.483159/page-69#post-8187319
Not sure how accurate it is but considering that, you know, he works on the thing, I'd take his word for it.
 

ClassyDragon

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Oh, right, that. No, if you do a full format, it'll also unlink the NNID. It'd be pretty stupid if you couldn't unlink it before giving it to someone else! Then again, it is Nintendo we're talking about...

By the way, something I came across just now in the freeShop thread: https://gbatemp.net/threads/release...eshop-alternative.483159/page-69#post-8187319
Not sure how accurate it is but considering that, you know, he works on the thing, I'd take his word for it.
Oh okay, I didn't know that. Still, I know a lot of people sell their system under the prospect of having games already installed on it. It's not impossible that Nintendo does this but I still think it's quite unlikely.
 

TankedThomas

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Oh okay, I didn't know that. Still, I know a lot of people sell their system under the prospect of having games already installed on it. It's not impossible that Nintendo does this but I still think it's quite unlikely.
This is true, and frankly, I've always thought it was a daft practise. Why would you want to willingly give people your email, access to your account, and potentially even a linked credit card (such as on a PlayStation where you can have it save your password and card)? It's really dumb.

Honestly, I think at that point, it's still on the end user for being a moron.

As far as I know though, they've already done actual system bans. I could be wrong though. It's been a while since I read all about bans, and I only ever had to deal with a seed ban once myself.
 

ClassyDragon

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This is true, and frankly, I've always thought it was a daft practise. Why would you want to willingly give people your email, access to your account, and potentially even a linked credit card (such as on a PlayStation where you can have it save your password and card)? It's really dumb.

Honestly, I think at that point, it's still on the end user for being a moron.

As far as I know though, they've already done actual system bans. I could be wrong though. It's been a while since I read all about bans, and I only ever had to deal with a seed ban once myself.
To be honest I think a lot of people just forget about that. Nintendo knows it has a lot of children in its audience, and a parent selling the console might not always remember they had to set up an account since, once linked, it doesn't really remind you about it a lot. It just seems like doing that could lead to a lot of angry customers, and I'm not sure the result would be worth it for Nintendo. I guess we'll find out soon enough though.
 
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TankedThomas

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To be honest I think a lot of people just forget about that. Nintendo knows it has a lot of children in its audience, and a parent selling the console might not always remember they had to set up an account since, once linked, it doesn't really remind you about it a lot. It just seems like doing that could lead to a lot of angry customers, and I'm not sure the result would be worth it for Nintendo. I guess we'll find out soon enough though.
I mean, you're right, but Nintendo don't care about angry customers unless they're all angry. Look at people who have had problems with the Switch - even if it's 0.01% of Switch owners, that's still about 2000 people. That's a pretty large number. Small compared to 20m, sure, but still large. If it's 0.1%, that's 20k people. And so on and so forth. Even at 5% - a whopping 100k Switch owners -, it's still unlikely Nintendo (or any big company like them) would deem this number high enough to worry about. And we're talking about actually defective consoles (caused by poor design choices on Nintendo's part). A system not being able to be played online is a much smaller issue (especially for the 3DS, since it won't be making them more money if you can play online, unlike the Switch).

Maybe they would be sympathetic, but usually they just tell people that they're out of luck in regards to being unbanned.
Would be great to integrate this into the CFW as an option to activate.
Eh, not really. It typically blocks the CDN in general, so it's a pain. Only use the DNS if you really need/want to. Personally, I've pretty much never used it. I think I used it once on my Wii U until I realised I'd already done everything else to prevent updates and so I didn't need to bother with it. If you want to do it yourself, it doesn't take that long to enable and just leave enabled.
 

ClassyDragon

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I mean, you're right, but Nintendo don't care about angry customers unless they're all angry. Look at people who have had problems with the Switch - even if it's 0.01% of Switch owners, that's still about 2000 people. That's a pretty large number. Small compared to 20m, sure, but still large. If it's 0.1%, that's 20k people. And so on and so forth. Even at 5% - a whopping 100k Switch owners -, it's still unlikely Nintendo (or any big company like them) would deem this number high enough to worry about. And we're talking about actually defective consoles (caused by poor design choices on Nintendo's part). A system not being able to be played online is a much smaller issue (especially for the 3DS, since it won't be making them more money if you can play online, unlike the Switch).

Maybe they would be sympathetic, but usually they just tell people that they're out of luck in regards to being unbanned.

Eh, not really. It typically blocks the CDN in general, so it's a pain. Only use the DNS if you really need/want to. Personally, I've pretty much never used it. I think I used it once on my Wii U until I realised I'd already done everything else to prevent updates and so I didn't need to bother with it. If you want to do it yourself, it doesn't take that long to enable and just leave enabled.
Yeah you're right. To me it just feels like something Nintendo wouldn't do, but I could very well be wrong.
 

blaisedinsd

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Trying to rap my head around this as I just upgraded my SD card to 64 GB and was having issues doing that and then updated my system because I thought it was safe to do so. Thought I bricked originally on Luma but then just updated bootfirm on the SD card.

So don't use that popular eshop alternative anymore for now is the main thing right? Even on older firmware? (I only updated one of my 3 systems).


I don't really care about being able to play online but I would still like to use that eshop alternative (or is it getting broken permanently and I should just download anything I want know before that?). I do have one console with a link NNID that I had been legit acquiring games before hacking.



How do I use GodMode9 to unlink that NNID?

Is this how?

  1. Navigate to SYSNAND CTRNAND -> data -> (32 Character ID) -> sysdata -> 00010038

  2. Hold down the (R) trigger, then press X on 00000000 to rename this file

  3. Press Up once to change the name to 10000000

  4. Press (A) to save changes

  5. Press (A) to unlock SysNAND writing, then input the key combo given

  6. Navigate back to the Main Menu

  7. Press Start to reboot




I use that NNID on Wii U (hacked) and Switch (unhacked) so I should probably do that to keep my ID safe right? Should I get it off Wii U somehow too I wonder?
 
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dAVID_

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My console is already banned from Nintendo Network anyway.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Well, we had a good run boys..
 

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