ROM Hack [Translation] Labyrinth no Kanata (Beyond the Labyrinth)

Jiro2 · Sep 19, 2017

gamesquest1 said:
You could buy the game, dump the .3ds file and apply the patch, or afaik it was uploaded prepatched to the usual places in CIA format, the simple fact is it's made hard not for fun or to laugh at people who don't understand how to perform the patch but to keep the patch completely legal, so no, unfortunately no uploading rooms to gbatemp or links to prepatched roms.

Creating a translation of a copyrighted work is, by law, creating a derivative work. If you don't have copyright to the twork and you distribute the translation is illegal. It's right in 17 U.S.C. § 101: "A “derivative work” is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted". 106 grants the copyright owner the "exclusive rights... to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work".

The idea that it's "legal" to distribute a fan translation is as wrong as the idea that you can pirate a ROM if you keep it for no more than 48 hours. The fan translation is absolutely not legal just because it isn't prepatched.

Gourmet · Sep 19, 2017

@Jiro2 delete this post! The US is not every country, and no one was ever indicted for this kinda shit, you don't want to spread this and make the first.

Julio Sotomayor · Sep 19, 2017

HAHA YOU WANTED TO DISCOURAGE PIRACY BY MAKING UR ENG PATCH AS HARD TO USE ON CITRA AS POSSIBLE BUT IT TURNS OUT YOU ARE ALSO A CRIMINAL HAHA

Now that's called KARMA folks!

FAN TRANSLATIONS' PRIORITY SHOULD ALWAYS BE TO MAKE SURE AS MANY PEEPS AS POSSIBLE CAN PLAY THE GAME IN THEIR LANGUAGE AND SHOULD NOT BE A TOOL USED TO FURTHER A MISGUIDED (AND DEEPLY PERSONAL ON THEIR PART) ATTEMPT TO DISCOURAGE WHAT THEY THINK IS "PIRACY".

gamesquest1 · Sep 19, 2017

Jiro2 said:
Creating a translation of a copyrighted work is, by law, creating a derivative work. If you don't have copyright to the twork and you distribute the translation is illegal. It's right in 17 U.S.C. § 101: "A “derivative work” is a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted". 106 grants the copyright owner the "exclusive rights... to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work".

The idea that it's "legal" to distribute a fan translation is as wrong as the idea that you can pirate a ROM if you keep it for no more than 48 hours. The fan translation is absolutely not legal just because it isn't prepatched.

while this is probably true is also much less likely for any developer to chase someone down and send cease and desist letters for what essentially amounts to translated subtitles, that said there has been examples of this in the past with things like anime subtitles but these cases are usually when it comes to works that will inevitably be legitimately translated by the devs and having a fan translation would impact future sales

I think the main point is that while developers like to keep all their exclusive rights on a strictly legal basis many developers tend to let things like translations go as long as the developer/s of such translations do not expressly redistribute the entirety or large parts of the work to enable piracy of the original work, the truth is this is one of those cases where iirc a few people went ahead and bought the game legitimately simply to apply this patch, so the original developer is kinda gaining extra sales (although I understand aftermarket sales don't really benefit them it might at least give them an idea for fan demand of future titles as does the existence of this patch)

this current method of distribution skirts along the fine line of piracy, sure in some aspects it probably would indeed be deemed illegal as we have seen many translation projects are left completely alone and never threatened with any legal action and this is imho due to the fact translators will after avoid supplying all/vast chunks of the original work which is imho a huge kick in the face of the original devs and one in sure many devs may feel compelled to respond to in an aggressive manner while translations that try their hardest not to encroach any further on their rights than absolutely necessary for the creation of the patch would imo be seen in a lesser damaging light as long as the original devs have no intention of ever doing a official translation

I feel that more and more developers are beginning to see fan projects as having a positive impact on their sales rather than negative which is why we are seeing more and more games open up to user generated content, and in the case of Sega allowing actual rom hacks to be shared, personally I would like to see fan translations as a separate clause in copyright law allowing them to legally exist so long as the original developer doesn't/isn't legitimately planning to localize the game itself and agreeing to take themselves down should the developers ever have a change of heart

so I see my statement as one of pre-emptive what "should" be law, while the argument against is that no patches/mods for any game should ever be allowed unless the developer/publisher gives permission to make/distribute mods/patches....which would be a sad stance to take

Julio Sotomayor · Sep 19, 2017

CITRA compatible rom of this game w/ the eng_patch coming tomorrow. Get hyped. Obviously I shall credit everything to our hard-working friend here.

medoli900 · Sep 19, 2017

You do know that fan translations are under the fair use law, as long as they don't ask for money for the translation, right? It's the same thing as music covers, as long as the developer didn't want to translate it in that particular language, fan translator are in the clear, since they don't obstruct any sales in the end. Even better, they makes some game more known, so more sale for the developer (theoretically, since piracy is a crime, and you should buy the game to patch the fan translation anyway). I would be very surprised if Steins;Gates 0 was localized if it weren't for the fan translation of the original Steins;Gates.

Julio Sotomayor · Sep 19, 2017

What about when companies steal fan translations and copy/paste it on their re-re-release of the game? You all know _exactly_ what i'm talking about.

Why should our hypothetical anti-hero patch maker bend backwards and try to please them when the (companies, et al) not only know that fan translation is "grey area" but they on multiple times outright take advantage of the situation and steal the work done by the fans.

Most recent example? The VC release of english-language MOTHER: Beginnings, the NES game. Gee, I sure do wonder where Nintendo got the script for that one... they must've been waiting til now to publish it! heh.

Jiro2 · Sep 19, 2017

medoli900 said:
You do know that fan translations are under the fair use law, as long as they don't ask for money for the translation, right?

That would let you translate a couple of sentences for use in a review, or translate it for your own use. You can't just translate the entire game and distribute it over the Internet.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Julio Sotomayor said:
Most recent example? The VC release of english-language MOTHER: Beginnings, the NES game. Gee, I sure do wonder where Nintendo got the script for that one... they must've been waiting til now to publish it! heh.

That game wasn't fan translated. The translation was produced by Nintendo; the prototype was already translated when it was found.

Julio Sotomayor · Sep 19, 2017

k, how about ff 5?

medoli900 · Sep 20, 2017

Jiro2 said:
That would let you translate a couple of sentences for use in a review, or translate it for your own use. You can't just translate the entire game and distribute it over the Internet.

Why would you not be able to "cover" a game in another language, but you could could cover a music into another language? These are under the same copyright laws. I agree that you can't distribute the translated game, since it still contain proprietary language, but patches does not necessarily contains proprietary content.

sarkwalvein · Sep 20, 2017

medoli900 said:
Why would you not be able to "cover" a game in another language, but you could could cover a music into another language? These are under the same copyright laws. I agree that you can't distribute the translated game, since it still contain proprietary language, but patches does not necessarily contains proprietary content.

There was a ruling in the EU not so long ago, and it kind of set a precedent. It was related to fansubs for movies/series, and it was found kind of illegal to do a distribute a fan-translated subtitle file if the copyright holder of the work that was being subbed didn't give permission to the given translator for creating that sub.
This is kind of related.

Edit: some kind of source.

medoli900 · Sep 20, 2017

This is a dumb thing to do though, since if someone pirate a medium to be able to put a file with the fan-translated sub, it should be the fault of the pirate, not the fan-subbing group. Sure, you can argue that they incite piracy, but you can also argue that they also incite more sale from the original source. Personally, I import all my games that I patch with some translation. That argument is so easily refuted that it tick me off that it actually passed.

Jiro2 · Sep 21, 2017

medoli900 said:
Why would you not be able to "cover" a game in another language, but you could could cover a music into another language? These are under the same copyright laws.

Making a cover version of music is subject to compulsory licenses. The copyright owner is required to let you make the cover version; however, doing so is not free. It doesn't apply to video games anyway.

I agree that you can't distribute the translated game, since it still contain proprietary language, but patches does not necessarily contains proprietary content.

Patches contain translated text. Translations are derivative works. Only the copyright holder may make derivative works.

Nagato · Sep 23, 2017

Deleted.

Cyan · Sep 23, 2017

thanks Nagato. Couldn't have said it better.
any offtopic message after your post will be deleted.
There are existing threads for that, use them.

Nazosan · Nov 10, 2017

Coming back to this after ages because I just randomly picked up the game again I thought I'd point out: LumaCFW now offers a new way that you can patch games. It can do some sort of overlay or something essentially. Thus people who have so much trouble could just do that. No ROM patching required. I think it can even do this with a cartridge. It might be worthwhile to make a release like that. This should make everyone happy. (Also, if you're doing any other such projects it's worth noting it's an easier and faster way to make changes since a modified version of a game doesn't have to be rebuilt every time.) It seems LumaCFW can also fix the invisible name bug with this game using part of its patching system. Create a folder called "titles" in the luma folder and in it make a folder with this game's title ID (0004000000065C00) and create a text file called locale.txt that simply contains the text "JPN JP" (no quotes) and nothing else. (Game patching has to be enabled in the Luma settings -- eg hold select on bootup and set it there -- for this to work.) EDIT: Seems the name fix has already been mentioned. Lol, oh well.

BTW, I just wanted to ask, but these days we have save editors for just about everything -- provided someone has actually thought to make one. By any chance at all has anyone anywhere produced one (I couldn't find it in a search) or by any chance is anyone willing to do one? The cheats go way too overboard for my liking personally. Sometimes one just wants to slightly tweak things a bit. Plus it's a royal PITA to use cheats for some of us at least.

rsc-pl · Nov 11, 2017

What's your problem guys?? I don't know how retarded people could be for bashing fan translations. This lies beyond my imagination.
And you know what? I prefer fan translations, I wish that more games already officially translated would have fan translations too. Fan translations are usually way more faithful to source, have original voices, no censorship, original names and no crap like 'jelly donuts'. I can buy original Japanese release (and most of my 3DS games are Japanese releases) and patch it. How can it even be considered as piracy.
I hate official translations so much that I started learning Japanese few years ago.
So gently please, *snip*, eat your burgers, enjoy your crappy censored and rewritten official 'translations' and get your life, *snip*.

Cyan · Nov 11, 2017

I agree with you, but please don't insult other users.
everyone is free to choose what they prefer.

gbafanwii · Jan 7, 2018

I wonder if there is a chance to release a patch that can be applied to a decrypted 3ds file. I'm trying to play the game with Citra emulator and doesn't work because the patch is only for an encrypted 3ds file.

Thank you in advance.

Subötaï · Mar 21, 2018

any way to decompress the save files?

ROM Hack [Translation] Labyrinth no Kanata (Beyond the Labyrinth)

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