Controversial trans athlete wins women's NYC cycling race

Holybond · Mar 24, 2023

I have qualms and questions just as much as the next person, but I always wondered why most guys even care about trans women breaking records in sports. It's not like women's sports are viewed as widely as male sports. I'm willing to bet you, most guys don't even care about women's sports to such a fervent degree. All in all, I'd chalk this up to a woman's issue. If Trans-women in sports becomes a large enough problem. Cis-women will begin voicing their concerns, but it can't be just one or two. It'd probably take a larger movement.

The interesting thing will be if trans-women become integrated in women's sports as a common thing, will it be seen as wrong to revert these changes depending on how far that progress has gone? People normally don't really jive with putting the cat back into the box.

It's one thing to not like trans people/LGBTQ since it's "in your face" especially online. It's another to guise not liking trans-people as some concern for women's sports. I'm going to stake the claim that most people don't care and they just want to use this as a focal point to "safely" put forth their rhetoric.

My biggest thing about the lack of good faith discussion on both sides is that. If Trans-Women are "taking" these spaces and opportunities from biological women. Would this not empower TERFS and TERF-based arguments more?

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

It's funny how biological advantages are seen as perfectly acceptable in male sports but seen as "unfair" in women's sports. Transphobia in women's sports doesn't just affect trans women, it affects cis women as well. Cis women also have to meet the requirements put on trans women. If the same standard were put into male sports, the rules would instantly be deemed "unfair" and shut down before they even got purposed. Let's not pretend this is about the fairness of women's sports, it's about fucking over trans people.

Deleted member 559230 · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
Let's not pretend this is about the fairness of women's sports, it's about fucking over trans people.

... and why would someone want to fuck over a trans person on the Internet. They are so kind, loving and accepting. They go around pushing their business on other people, getting people banned, forcing their opinions on others and if you disagree with their agenda you're labeled a transphobe and cancelled. Yeah, no reason to not want to "fuck them over".

mrdude · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
It's funny how biological advantages are seen as perfectly acceptable in male sports but seen as "unfair" in women's sports. Transphobia in women's sports doesn't just affect trans women, it affects cis women as well. Cis women also have to meet the requirements put on trans women. If the same standard were put into male sports, the rules would instantly be deemed "unfair" and shutdown before it even got purposed. Let's not pretend this is about the fairness of women's sports, it's about fucking over trans people.

There's no such thing as a "Cis" woman, there's only real women and men that dress as women, take drugs and wear makeup so they can pretend to be one.

Biological/genetic advantages such as strength/speed etc are present in every living creature - you are confusing those with the difference between the genetic and biological makeup between males and females. You know deep down in your heart that if you have a male body & genetics that you have an advantage over a real woman of similar fitness level, height for their sex, weight for their sex etc. Deep down you know it's wrong to compete against women, but you're too weak to go against a man so try and validate yourself in other ways.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

JonhathonBaxster said:
... and why would someone want to fuck over a trans person on the Internet. They are so kind, loving and accepting. They go around pushing their business on other people, getting people banned, forcing their opinions on others and if you disagree with their agenda you're labeled a transphobe and cancelled. Yeah, no reason to not want to "fuck them over".

You didn't address a single point in my post and decided to go for this approach instead, so it's safe to assume that I am correct.

Deleted member 559230 · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
You didn't address a single point in my post and decided to go for this approach instead, so it's safe to assume that I am correct.

Assume what you will, you're good at that.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

JonhathonBaxster said:
Assume what you will, you're good at that.

Address my post properly and prove me wrong then. It shouldn't be that much of a challenge, yet you constantly fail to do so.

mrdude said:
There's no such thing as a "Cis" woman, there's only real women and men that dress as women, take drugs and wear makeup so they can pretend to be one.

Biological/genetic advantages such as strength/speed etc are present in every living creature - you are confusing those with the difference between the genetic and biological makeup between males and females. You know deep down in your heart that if you have a male body & genetics that you have an advantage over a real woman of similar fitness level, height for their sex, weight for their sex etc. Deep down you know it's wrong to compete against women, but you're too weak to go against a man so try and validate yourself in other ways.

I know deep down that evidance has been shown that trans women aren't dominating sports and it's only the expectations that are brought attention to by the media. My points still stand, male sports are dominated by guys with advantages that set them apart from other people, for example, height in basketball. This is seen as acceptable in male sports but women with high T are put on T-blockers in female sports. Women in female sports are required to meet standards that put them at a disadvantage when they have an advantage, how is that considered acceptable? That being said, trans women are real women and there's no amount of your bullshit that changes that. It's not a debate, you're just a mean person and I hope one day you realize that.

mrdude · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
That being said, trans women are real women and there's no amount of your bullshit that changes that. It's not a debate, you're just a mean person and I hope one day you realize that.

A real women doesn't need to take drugs, get parts of their body chopped off (or wear prosthetics) or wear makeup to look like a woman, they have a different skeleton, chemical structure etc. You could dump them on a desert island with food and water for 5 years and they'd still be a real woman, dig up their skeletons in 5000 years and still identify them as a women.

A pretend woman on the other hand........well, you aint fooling me, anyone else living or the archeologist in 5000 years time. You might tell yourself that you're a female, but your genetic makup is a fact, and the fact is that you're a male and attempting to convince yourself otherwise is just lying to yourself, come out of the closet and just admit that you were born a male and will die the same no matter what anyone tells you to the contrary. This goes the same for those males that compete in womans sports - they are nothing but cheats and trying to take away another thing from real women.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

mrdude said:
A real women doesn't need to take drugs, get parts of their body chopped off (or wear prosthetics) or wear makeup to look like a woman, they have a different skeleton, chemical structure etc. You could dump them on a desert island with food and water for 5 years and they'd still be a real woman, dig up their skeletons in 5000 years and still identify them as a women.

A pretend woman on the other hand........well, you aint fooling me, anyone else living or the archeologist in 5000 years time. You might tell yourself that you're a female, but your genetic makup is a fact, and the fact is that you're a male and attempting to convince yourself otherwise is just lying to yourself, come out of the closet and just admit that you were born a male and will die the same no matter what anyone tells you to the contrary. This goes the same for those males that compete in womans sports - they are nothing but cheats and trying to take away another thing from real women.

I am not a girl, so I don't need to keep telling myself that I am. I also really don't care what someone does with my ashes in 5000 years but I do hope that something stupid will be done with them.
You didn't really address anything I brought up though, why is there a double standard in sports? Why are men's sports dominated by men who have advantages over other men but women's sports require deliberately hindering women with advantages over other women? It's worth noting that cis women do often require the same treatment as trans women, including HRT and surgeries. Cis women are not immune to issues requiring the same treatment.

JuanMena · Mar 24, 2023

JonhathonBaxster said:
Assume what you will, you're good at that.

I have never laughed so hard before reading something.
:rofl2:

impeeza · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
It's funny how biological advantages are seen as perfectly acceptable in male sports but seen as "unfair" in women's sports. Transphobia in women's sports doesn't just affect trans women, it affects cis women as well. Cis women also have to meet the requirements put on trans women. If the same standard were put into male sports, the rules would instantly be deemed "unfair" and shut down before they even got purposed. Let's not pretend this is about the fairness of women's sports, it's about fucking over trans people.

funny because on all 1 to 1 contact sports there are categories because biological advantages are not considered fair on man sports too. you have divisions for age and sometimes weight.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

impeeza said:
funny because on all 1 to 1 contact sports there are categories because biological advantages are not considered fair on man sports too. you have divisions for age and sometimes weight.

That's true but I am more talking about sports like football, basketball, etc. Sports where someone like Shaq, Manute Bol, and
Yao Ming isn't considered unfair and no one debates if their massive presence puts others at a disadvantage.

impeeza · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
That's true but I am more talking about sports like football, basketball, etc. Sports where someone like Shaq, Manute Bol, and
Yao Ming isn't considered unfair and no one debates if their massive presence puts others at a disadvantage.

normally an individual can not be a team, on a team of 12 peoples superman can't do all the job.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

impeeza said:
normally an individual can not be a team, on a team of 12 peoples superman can't do all the job.

I think you might be missing the point, my point is that no one debates this kind of topic in male sports but they are heavily debated when it comes to female sports. For example, women in female sports are often put on T-blockers if their testosterone is too high. Women can be rejected from sports for having "unfair advantages" over other women. This isn't a standard found in male sports and would quickly be shutdown if someone suggested any similar standards be implemented.

JuanMena · Mar 24, 2023

impeeza said:
normally an individual can not be a team, on a team of 12 peoples superman can't do all the job.

Wrong: They/Them now equals one.
Is called Language Evolution... I think?
lel

mrdude · Mar 24, 2023

Womens Charity Sports event - Cheating Scenario: Johnny speaking to Fred:

Johnny: Hey Fred had you seen Big Tam?
Fred: Yes, he's borrowed his wifes wig and is going by the name "Tam-ette" today.
Johnny: How come?
Fred: There's a womens arm wrestling competition with $5K prize money.
Johnny: Who's the competiton?
Fred: Wee Jane from the next village.
Johnny: Isn't that cheating?, I mean Big Tam is 6'5" and built like a tank, Wee Jane is only 5'2" and a good wind would blow her over.
Fred: It's OK Tam is identifying as a woman for the day, plus he's going to take us to the pub with the $5k he wins.
Johnny: Ah right, I see that's OK then, fuck Wee Jane, so what if she's been training for the last 2 years for this.
Fred: Yep, fuck her - Big Tam can identify however he wants - let's go to the pub now, there's a good game of football to watch.

Post automatically merged: Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
I think you might be missing the point, my point is that no one debates this kind of topic in male sports but they are heavily debated when it comes to female sports.

That's because women that think they are men are not crushing men or dominating in any sport when they go against a man.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

mrdude said:
Womens Charity Sports event - Cheating Scenario: Johnny speaking to Fred:

Johnny: Hey Fred had you seen Big Tam?
Fred: Yes, he's borrowed his wifes wig and is going by the name "Tam-ette" today.
Johnny: How come?
Fred: There's a womens arm wrestling competition with $5K prize money.
Johnny: Who's the competiton?
Fred: Wee Jane from the next village.
Johnny: Isn't that cheating?, I mean Big Tam is 6'5" and built like a tank, Wee Jane is only 5'2" and a good wind would blow her over.
Fred: It's OK Tam is identifying as a woman for the day, plus he's going to take us to the pub with the $5k he wins.
Johnny: Ah right, I see that's OK then, fuck Wee Jane, so what if she's been training for the last 2 years for this.
Fred: Yep, fuck her - Big Tam can identify however he wants - let's go to the pub now, there's a good game of football to watch.

This has literally never happened and you don't have sources of this happening because it's just made-up nonsense.

impeeza · Mar 24, 2023

The Catboy said:
This has literally never happened and you don't have sources of this happening because it's just made-up nonsense.

It happen here for the "panamerican games" the winner is still fighting on court if his winning is fair.

The Catboy · Mar 24, 2023

*Mod snip*

I see we've gotten to this point without even addressing the main concerns about the double standards in sports. I think I've proven my point quite nicely, it's not about women's sports, it's about beating down on trans people. You've provided no evidance or really even a decent reply to my questions. To quote me again,

The Catboy said:
It's funny how biological advantages are seen as perfectly acceptable in male sports but seen as "unfair" in women's sports. Transphobia in women's sports doesn't just affect trans women, it affects cis women as well. Cis women also have to meet the requirements put on trans women. If the same standard were put into male sports, the rules would instantly be deemed "unfair" and shut down before they even got purposed. Let's not pretend this is about the fairness of women's sports, it's about fucking over trans people.

The standards for women's sports are far more favorable towards punishing women who have advantages compared to male sports where they were typically seen as desirable. I've still yet to see a single reply from you that actually address this concern, you've only replied with transphobia and anti-trans women jabs at me. So far, I am starting to assume that you don't actually care about the issues and just want to punch down on trans people.

KingVamp · Mar 24, 2023

Well, to be fair, in 5000 years we could probably change our DNA like we change our clothes. That is, if we survive and thrive long enough.

mrdude said:
there's only males and females. Everything else is just some made up gibberish.

KingVamp said:
Intersex.

Controversial trans athlete wins women's NYC cycling race

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