Would be a shame if all parties came to the bargaining table to hash out an agreement. Instead, we're stumbling into World War III with a nuclear power. Good thing the adults are in charge now.
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US to give Ukraine long range missiles
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Zelensky has an agreement already, the Russians don't want it
the agreement is Russia recognizes the sovereignty of Ukraine and leaves Ukraine
What other agreement could there be? Would you be for an agreement where China invades Hawaii and we give them the land because "we must avoid upsetting the bad guys"?
That's a one sided agreement and that's not how the world works. Nobody gets everything they want in every situation. Look into what issues Russia was having with Ukraine for the past 10 years leading up to this.
The goal here should be avoid a nuclear war. Instead people who used to be anti-war before I was born are now hot and heavy for some war. As long as they don't have to go do the fighting.
Take it from somebody who's been in a warzone. It is no fun at all, especially for the civilians. The Ukrainian people are the ones who are suffering here, not the leaders.
Hey dude what warzones were you in? I did tours in Bosnia 4 times - 2 during the war and 2 implementing the dayton peace accords (UN/IFOR/SFOR), Kosovo twice straight after Nato bombed the hell out of Serbia (KFOR), Iraq (both wars), and Afghanistan (ISAF), maybe we crossed paths at some point.
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Your proposal is literally to give Putin everything he wants. To reward him for an unprovoked imperialist invasion. And you think that somehow wouldn't encourage him to do it all again? That's either delusional, naive, or both.
The goal is to get Russia the fuck out of Ukraine. If Putin ever starts truly considering the possibility of deploying nukes, he needs to be assassinated. As things stand now, however, MAD holds the same as it always has.
I was in Iraq. Something about WMD's or something.
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If you were curious enough to look at recent history, you would know it wasn't completely unprovoked.
And do you actually believe assassinating him would stop nuclear war? That sounds like an emotional response. The exact kind of response that would start a world war. Go read up on World War I for a little perspective.
If World War III starts, you should be first in line to enlist and go fight it, but we all know you won't.
Where about? I was in Basra in the old Airport (Shaibah log base) for about 3 months and also spent about 3 months in Nasiriyah next to that Ziggurat (camp Mitica). There was a big yank camp there where I used to go for my food. WMD's so GW2 then, what Telic were you on? I was on 1 attached to The Queens Royal Lancers.
Last edited by mrdude,
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Even the Kremlin has long since dropped the facade and excuses, admitting to the fact that they invaded solely to gain land and resources.
If Putin is truly insane enough to launch nukes on a whim, there's nothing that could stop him. All the more reason why appeasement of a madman doesn't work. As long as he fears death and still feels he has something to lose, however, deploying nukes isn't really an option. It's an empty threat that Russia has made about a hundred times too many.
I was in Mosul at the airport and then Kirkuk, also at the airport.
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I thought we weren't supposed to believe the Kremlin? Did something change?
At least we've cleared up the question if you actually cared about Ukrainians, the people who actually have to live in this war zone. It is so obvious you have never been in a war zone. This is why leftists push for war. It's safe to say very few of you would ever enlist to go fight it. I know for a fact the Army doesn't provide soy, so that would be a hardship tour for you based on that alone.
Gotta be honest, I miss the anti-war left of the 60's and 70's. At least they stood for something.
I wasn't in those areas, still at least you're not one of those blue haired armchair generals that are giving out war advice when the nearest thing they have come to war is to screech about someone using not their preferred pronouns and they once took a library book back late. You probably despise those weirdo's as much a I do. I'd love for them to be sent to a real war, on the frontline and those calling for war to have to be the first ones that were sent. The fact they haven't already gone to Ukraine when they could have tells you a lot about them really. They talk the talk but would never walk the walk.
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Oh it's entirely believable that Putin is a power-hungry sociopath willing to sacrifice any number of Russians and Ukrainians for his own corrupt, small-minded goals. It's not believable that an ex-KGB agent would invade a neighboring country out of a sense of altruism.
Able-bodied Ukrainians naturally have a desire to defend their homeland from imperialist invaders. You, on the other hand, want to make the disingenuous claim that giving a warmonger what he wants will fix everything, rather than just leading to even more war. Ukraine did not start this fight, but with the support of the US and Europe they'll sure as hell have everything they need to end it. Much to your dismay, I'm sure.
Supporting Ukraine in this conflict is the anti-war position, you fucking muppet. The sooner Russia's military is driven back to their own gods-forsaken country, the sooner Putin's total and utter defeat is realized. Anyone like you, who supports concessions to a ruthless dictator, falls firmly into the category of pro-imperialism and pro-war. Fence-sitting is not an option when one side is clearly in the wrong and understands only the language of violence.
Last edited by Xzi,
the sheer amount of stupid coming outta trader's mouth right now... lol Putin says he wants the land back from before it was divided up in the past. he's been trying since he got in. the war happened because the world allowed him to take some of ukraines land already but he's still trying for more.(crimea) He wants that farmland and those those oil fields. but most importantly he's delusional and an aggressive man child.
he started this more than 8 years ago. it's about time we all woke up and started resisting
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Takes a whole lot of mental gymnastics for him to claim to be anti-war while simultaneously supporting the aggressor who has the power to end the war at any time. Hypocrites gonna hypocrite.
Last edited by Xzi,
Enough of the we, So when are YOU going to go anywhere and fight? Or do you just expect others to do that???
YOU won't go to Ukraine, because it's not your country, it's also not a NATO member and has never paid any money into NATO and really is none of your business. There's also these conflicts going on in the world just now if you want to get on your high horse about world injustices, so pack your bags, get over there and tell us all about it if you make it home:
Ukraine/Russia - war
Afghanistan-civil war & terrorist insurgency
Burkina Faso-terrorist insurgency
Colombia-civil war/drug war
DR Congo-terrorist insurgency
Ethiopia-civil war
Iraq-terrorist insurgency & political unrest
Mali-civil war & terrorist insurgency
Mexico-drug war
Nigeria-terrorist insurgency
Somalia-civil war
South Sudan-ethnic violence
Sudan-terrorist insurgency
Syria-civil war
Yemen-civil war
However I won't be holding my breath on waiting for your return from any of those places, because we all know you won't go anywhere - wars are for other people, you can stick to your PS4/5, XBOX or Switch and play some war games because that's about as close as you're going to get to a war unless you get called up when Russia get pissed off with your interfering and decide it's just going to nuke you.
actually i won't go to ukraine cause someone with chron's disease is only gonna slow them down. why aren't you fighting? or is it true that russia has propagandists in forums and social media spreading it's garbage?
Ah right, so when you said we should fight or start resisting - what you really meant was someone else apart from you!
Why would I want to? Neither of them are my county and I don't care what happens in either of them. They are both corrupt, and both led by corrupt dictators. Swapping out one dictator for another isn't going to make any difference to the people of that country - they will still have someones boot on their necks whoever wins this war. Fighting or dying so that some corrupt regime can lead a country is not what I would choose to fight or die for. Russia has already won, if you can't see that you are crazy.
Here's a fun fact for you. Russia is the most sanctioned country in the world and in the history of the world. It's ecomony outpaced UK and Germany in 2023 and barely sharnk at all even with all those sanctions. On the other hand, look how trillions of dollars were printed since the Biden Admin and how the dollar has been devalued - you can see this everytime you go to the shops to buy food with your record high prices and your high energy costs. Then there's the state sponsored terrorism from the USA by blowing up another countries infracstucture (which you are not technincally at war with), not to mention the fact that now because of that people in Europe are paying sky high energy prices because we now need to import gas from USA. Your own head of governemt (Biden) is about as corrupt as they come, people have been telling you this for a long time and people that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
Yep. Also, George W. Bush is an alumni of Skull and Bones (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/may/20/usa.internationaleducationnews). Skull and Bones was involved in the opium trade (mentioned in the aforementioned article). Opium production in Iraq increased after deposing Saddam Hussein and throwing the nation into chaos (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-as-farmers-try-to-make-ends-meet-770651.html). Now we're in the midst of an opioid crisis. Maybe the unsubstantiated claims of weapons of mass destruction were a self fulfilling prophesy in reference to opium, assuming the opium crisis is reality rather than hyperreality.
The immorality and cost of a previous military engagement does not necessitate the positive virtue of the current military engagement. This argument is a non-sequitur.
The inconvenient fact for warmongers is that Iraqis and Russians, contrary to the propaganda we are constantly fed, are no less human than Ukrainians and US citizens. I don't care that Saddam Hussein and Vladimir Putin were/are ruthless dictators. The people they rule(d) over and that are/were compelled to serve them are/were just as human as you and me. All of them Imago Dei (Gen. 1:27). The sins of their leadership did/do not justify destroying their lives. Also, the phrase "collateral damage" is a propagandic euphemism for victimizing these people. I don't believe turning Russia into another Berlin Wall era Germany, Vietnam, Iraq, or Afghanistan has any beneficial effect toward the elimination of dictatorships. I think warmongers in Washington DC claiming to be Christians and professing salvation in Christ that support engaging in these conflicts have neglected Romans 12:9-21. Contrary to the Quran (Surah 9:5), evangelism by the sword is not effective, hence the stubborn persistence of Christianity within Muslim nations imposing the death penalty to heretical infidels (https://www.msn.com/en-za/news/othe...and-set-alight-by-angry-muslim-mob/ar-AAXeF8G). I think Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan are sufficient examples providing evidence that the evangelism of US democracy by the sword is not effective either.
Do you remember how goofy the Kony 2012 propaganda campaign was? I recognize that it was a long time ago and the ridiculously fast news cycle discourages long-term memory retention (by intentional design), but the Ukraine-Russia media coverage reminds me of that.
No one is claiming Russians are not human
All we want is Russia to stop its illegal occupation of a sovereign nation, its mass bombing of civilian infrastructure and its continued illegal war and invasion - and to respect international law and leave Ukraine
It sure has fooled me with rhetoric equating Russia as the Great Satan to infallibly righteous, holy, and divine deity of US democracy. There is a secular religion in the US that extols and worships democracy above all else.
What is a legal war and invasion? Ought it ever be considered legal to cause mass suffering through military engagement? Are not the US and other allies guilty of prolonging this suffering among Ukrainians and Russians?
I attended high school with Ukrainian and Russian foreign exchange students. I do not support perpetuating their suffering, regardless of the justifications I'm being fed by media. If Iraq and Afghanistan were mistakes, why repeat them through Ukraine and Russia?
Haha - Pot/Kettle/Black - irony is lost on you, USA invaded Iraq and Afghanistan (both sovereign nations) for over 20+ years. It's also been involved in other wars and covert ops throughout the world in my lifetime such as Vietnam, Grenada, Somalia, Serbia/Kosovo, Libya, Syria,Yemen etc....
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Xdqwerty:
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