The next generation of gaming isn't quite here yet, but we're starting to see glimpses of what will be, through teases and hinting. Today, we got another look at what Sony has up its sleeves, during a corporate strategy meeting. Takashi Mochizuki, a reporter for The Wall Street Journal attended the meeting, where he took video of Sony showcasing "immersive" and "seamless" loading for their next-gen successor to the PlayStation 4.

• The two keywords for the future direction of PlayStation® are “immersive” and “seamless.”
  • Next-generation console: “Immersive” experience created by dramatically increased graphics rendering speeds, achieved through the employment of further improved computational power and a customized ultra-fast, broadband SSD.
  • PlayStation streaming: Through the evolution of “Remote Play” and “PlayStation™Now,” provide a seamless game experience anytime, anywhere.
    • Remote Play: Turns PlayStation®4(PS4™), which is expected to reach 100 million units in cumulative sales this calendar year, into a streaming game server, providing streaming content at the closest point to users.
    • PlayStation Now: Provides immersive game experiences to users regardless of whether they own a PS4 console at all.

• Sony will pursue its mission to make PlayStation “The Best Place to Play” by leveraging the latest computing, streaming, cloud, and 5G technologies, together with excellent content.
  • As part of these efforts, Sony agreed to a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Microsoft Corp. (Microsoft) to collaborate on the development of cloud solutions, including game streaming services.

In the footage, we can see Spider-Man running on a PlayStation 4 Pro, as well as the upcoming new PlayStation system. Quickly loading the game world on the PS4 Pro results in pauses for the game to render everything, while the "PS5" that's running the same game has no major loading times. According to the press release, this is partly due to "a customized, ultra-fast broadband solid state drive".

Sony's official video comparing performance of PS4 Pro vs next-gen PlayStation pic.twitter.com/2eUROxKFLq

— Takashi Mochizuki (@6d6f636869) May 21, 2019

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We will harness the power of new technology to offer completely transformative and immersive gaming experiences We will leverage Backwards Compatibility to transition our community to Next Gen faster and more seamlessly than ever before We provide stability of environment for content creators

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Additionally, an investor briefing goes into more detail, mentioning that the PlayStation 4 will still provide a "critical role" for around three more years, with major AAA games still arriving on the platform, like The Last of Us Part II, Death Stranding, and Ghosts of Tsushima, which will ensure success due to the massive amount of PS4 owners. Sony has lofty goals for their new hardware, specifying backwards compatibility, 3D audio, more powerful components, the ability to still use physical media, and even 8K.

Source: PR
Source: Briefing

 

[Spider_Man]

All these peolle raging about 4k ot 8k really wtf.

Nothing wrong with 1080p id rather have quality games than 8k resolution.

Resolution means shit if the textures and model detail is shit... i know i wont be rushing to buy any next gen system.

This gen has been a massive let down, same call of duty, assassins creed, fifa, far cry shit recycled titles.

I refuse to buy a new console to play these same shit recycled titles and wow shove this 8k shit up your arse.

Got an xbox one x at launch found its so called 4k looked no fucking different as such, the same textures looked the same, your model again same. Wow screen slightly sharper.... bore off.

Ohh and running last gen title on next gen hardware is retarded, maybe show us something thats for the hardware and taking resources.

I know ssd drives provide faster speeds but it depends how much has to be loaded and hope sony find a very reliable manufacturer/supplier

 

[KingVamp]

I just hope more games gives you performance/graphic options.

 

[Edgarska]

Raytracing can be done on GTX cards and even AMD can do it without dedicated "R" cores.

It can be done in the sense that consoles can do 4K, which is "not really".

 

[Foxi4]

It can be done in the sense that consoles can do 4K, which is "not really".

You don't need dedicated hardware to do raytracing, it just works better with dedicated hardware. In fact, Nvidia released a driver update which enabled RTX features on a range of non-RTX GPU's specifically to showcase how much faster it is with dedicated cores.



There is nothing that prevents AMD or game designers from using raytracing on AMD GPU's. There's no magic inside of those RT cores, they're just running the BVH algorithm and other related math while the main GPU cores focus on different rendering tasks.

 

[Edgarska]

You don't need dedicated hardware to do raytracing, it just works better with dedicated hardware. In fact, Nvidia released a driver update which enabled RTX features on a range of non-RTX GPU's, specifically to showcase how much faster it is with dedicated cores.



There is nothing that prevents AMD or game designers from using raytracing on AMD GPU's.

Yes, that is what the image I linked shows. My point is that it's unusably slow. Not to mention the new consoles will likely use integrated graphics, not a full GPU.
I could be wrong and they could make a very powerful console for over $500, or sell it at a massive loss.

 

[kumikochan]

Yes, that is what the image I linked shows. My point is that it's unusably slow. Not to mention the new consoles will likely use integrated graphics, not a full GPU.
I could be wrong and they could make a very powerful console for over $500, or sell it at a massive loss.

Didn't most developers already said who have the new developer units said it will be sold with quite a loss ?

 

[Foxi4]

Yes, that is what the image I linked shows. My point is that it's unusably slow. Not to mention the new consoles will likely use integrated graphics, not a full GPU.
I could be wrong and they could make a very powerful console for over $500, or sell it at a massive loss.

Why would using an integrated GPU pose a limitation? The opposite is true - putting the GPU directly on the same die as the CPU, thermal considerations aside, reduces latency and allows direct communication between the two. It's by far a superior solution for a standardised system that's not meant to be upgraded. The main advantages of a discrete GPU are upgradeability and dedicated cooling, the former is not a factor in console design and the latter is a matter of clever design. As for the "unusably slow", that's debatable - consoles don't run games on Ultra and don't aim at framerates in excess of 60 - with the detail level and geometry pulled back a notch I think it's perfectly feasible, much like 4K is "feasible" on the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X. Don't expect bells and whistles, but it can be done.

 

[Edgarska]

Didn't most developers already said who have the new developer units said it will be sold with quite a loss ?

I only saw what was in the op so I wasn't aware of that, but considering the price of a an RTX card, or conversely, the power needed to bruteforce it without dedicated ray tracing hardware, it would have to be a serious loss. Even then, it wouldn't be cheap.

 

[Foxi4]

I only saw what was in the op so I wasn't aware of that, but considering the price of a an RTX card, or conversely, the power needed to bruteforce it without dedicated ray tracing hardware, it would have to be a serious loss. Even then, it wouldn't be cheap.

I don't think we should make assumptions on whether or not the APU has dedicated raytracing ALU's - it very well might.

 

[kumikochan]

I only saw what was in the op so I wasn't aware of that, but considering the price of a an RTX card, or conversely, the power needed to bruteforce it without dedicated ray tracing hardware, it would have to be a serious loss. Even then, it wouldn't be cheap.

well at the price nvidia is selling it sure but who knows, maybe AMD has a cheap solution in the works and a lesser form of dedicated raytracing but still okay by console standards. I myself don't use raytracing tho despite me owning a 2080Ti

 

[Edgarska]

. As for the "unusably slow", that's debatable - consoles don't run games on Ultra and don't aim at framerates in excess of 60 - with the detail level and geometry pulled back a notch I think it's perfectly feasible, much like 4K is "feasible" on the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X. Don't expect bells and whistles, but it can be done.

That's part of my point, there are already people claiming next gen consoles will have power comparable to high end PCs, just like it was claimed back when this generation started, when in reality they "might" be able to do all that stuff, but severely limited.

I'm not saying it won't be able to do ray tracing, just that it won't be very good at it, and the 8K will probably be upscaled just like most games on the X/Pro do 4K on graphically intensive games.

 

[GBADWB]

Yes, that is what the image I linked shows. My point is that it's unusably slow. Not to mention the new consoles will likely use integrated graphics, not a full GPU.
I could be wrong and they could make a very powerful console for over $500, or sell it at a massive loss.

There's no real significant difference between having a large gpu on the same die of the CPU and having it in a dedicated form factor. What matters is how many stream processors are included with the cpu. On the desktop MOST apus do not leave much of a gpu on die due to size and heat constraints, but it doesnt stop the existance of APU's with larger gpu core counts.

two prime examples would be Intel's Hades Canyon NUC, which uses AMD Vega 20 (24 CU, slightly smaller than the RX 470, which is 28 CU), and the Subor Z+ custom processor (same GPu layout, but 4 ryzen cores instead of Intel Hades Canyon cores).


Integrated graphics only gets its low performance rep because most people who want powerful systems do not want all in one processors where replacing one means you'd need to replace both.

 

[Foxi4]

well at the price nvidia is selling it sure but who knows, maybe AMD has a cheap solution in the works and a lesser form of dedicated raytracing but still okay by console standards. I myself don't use raytracing tho despite me owning a 2080Ti

AMD is unquestionably the king of affordable hardware, for sure. The One X is already pushing 6 tflops, double that in 2020-2021 with a modest price bump seems perfectly reasonable to me.

 

[tigersaman]

I can almost hear ps5 fans taking off by just rendering Dashboard on 8K

 

[Edgarska]

well at the price nvidia is selling it sure but who knows, maybe AMD has a cheap solution in the works and a lesser form of dedicated raytracing but still okay by console standards. I myself don't use raytracing tho despite me owning a 2080Ti

Personally, I still think ray tracing is not worth the performance impact at the moment, except perhaps for reflections, since soft shadows and global illumination can be faked very effectively with conventional means. For that matter, I think consoles should have focused on delivering 1080p/60fps before trying to handle upscaled 4K at 30fps.

 

[Foxi4]

That's part of my point, there are already people claiming next gen consoles will have power comparable to high end PCs, just like it was claimed back when this generation started, when in reality they "might" be able to do all that stuff, but severely limited.

I'm not saying it won't be able to do ray tracing, just that it won't be very good at it, and the 8K will probably be upscaled just like most games on the X/Pro do 4K on graphically intensive games.

If the rumours are to be believed, I'd happily place 12 tflops in the high end of computational power as of today. Naturally, as is always the case with tech, it will be mid-tier on the PC scene in the blink of an eye while the consoles will have to chug along for another 5-10 years, however long the next generation will last. Consoles will always lag behind PC's, that's sort of the point - the hardware is standardised. It's spaghetti factory, which has certain advantages.

Personally, I still think ray tracing is not worth the performance impact at the moment, except perhaps for reflections, since soft shadows and global illumination can be faked very effectively with conventional means. For that matter, I think consoles should have focused on delivering 1080p/60fps before trying to handle upscaled 4K at 30fps.

To me, RTX is the definition of diminishing returns. It's an amazing next generation technology that makes lighting and reflections so much more realistic, and it has such an amazingly unimpressive result in motion. I can count the times I was impressed by lighting or reflections on one hand - I look at the water, think "that's cool" and move along to continue playing the game. Physics are different - they changed the way we play video games. Lighting? I can live without, I'll take good, stable framerates all day everyday.

 

[Edgarska]

If the rumours are to be believed, I'd happily place 12 tflops in the high end of computational power as of today. Naturally, as is always the case with tech, it will be mid-tier on the PC scene in the blink of an eye while the consoles will have to chug along for another 5-10 years, however long the next generation will last. Consoles will always lag behind PC's, that's sort of the point - the hardware is standardised. It's spaghetti factory, which has certain advantages.

When the XBX was still project Scorpio, the rumors said it could have around the performance of a GTX 1070, and since then we've seen that it matches a GTX 1060 almost exactly, so I don't put much stock on rumors. It's also why I don't pay much attention to theoretical performance, since its 6 teraflops don't seem to help its real world performance that much.

 

[Foxi4]

When the XBX was still project Scorpio, the rumors said it could have around the performance of a GTX 1070, and since then we've seen that it matches a GTX 1060 almost exactly, so I don't put much stock on rumors. It's also why I don't pay much attention to theoretical performance, since its 6 teraflops don't seem to help its real world performance that much.

You have to take into account that it's a stopgap console - merely an upgraded Xbox One. I personally *had* to switch to the X because the performance of the S became unbareable with subsequent updates of the dash, so I see the difference, but there's no denying that the GPU is bottlenecked by the CPU side of the APU. Hooking up a 6 tflop GPU to what's effectively an overclocked mobile CPU is a recipie for a bad time, I suspect the next generation consoles based on the superior Zen architecture will alleviate many of the problems consoles suffer from now.

 

[Pipistrele]

Are people really this fucking retarded and uninformed about the ps5?

Are there permanent life benefits to being informed about PS5?

 

[kumikochan]

If the rumours are to be believed, I'd happily place 12 tflops in the high end of computational power as of today. Naturally, as is always the case with tech, it will be mid-tier on the PC scene in the blink of an eye while the consoles will have to chug along for another 5-10 years, however long the next generation will last. Consoles will always lag behind PC's, that's sort of the point - the hardware is standardised. It's spaghetti factory, which has certain advantages.

To me, RTX is the definition of diminishing returns. It's an amazing next generation technology that makes lighting and reflections so much more realistic, and it has such an amazingly unimpressive result in motion. I can count the times I was impressed by lighting or reflections on one hand - I look at the water, think "that's cool" and move along to continue playing the game. Physics are different - they changed the way we play video games. Lighting? I can live without, I'll take good, stable framerates all day everyday.

Yeah i do agree one hundred percent