So I wondered why the 10.3 update for the N3DS was so much larger than the 9.2 update (110 titles vs 102), and it got me thinking that maybe when we downgrade we are leaving some updated titles present that weren't there on 9.2 and maybe this was the problem. (I also wondered why the O3DS 9.2 update was 126 titles. Where did the other 24 come from?)
After doing some looking into the SOAP replies for the various N3DS and O3DS updates, I have realized I was about half right. Over the course of updates from 9.2 to 10.3, several titles were added to the N3DS SOAP replies that were already included on the system but had not been updated before.
To start with, the reason the O3DS reply has more titles is because each update must be cumulative and include titles updated in previous updates, even if the current one does not update it. Otherwise we would not be able to jump from, say, 4.5 all the way to 9.2. For the O3DS, this means some titles are included in the reply that haven't been updated since 2.x or 3.x (like the Download Play or DS Internet titles). The N3DS, however, shipped with these titles already installed so Nintendo culled them from the SOAP reply, likely to save on bandwidth. Over time several of these titles have been added to the SOAP reply for the N3DS, possibly to prepare for potential updates to those services. Nearest I can tell most of them were probably simply included in the SOAP reply without actually being updated(like a few TWL titles like DS Internet and the whitelist). But a few DID receive updates when they were included.
This brings us to the crux of the problem. Those few system services that did receive actual updates between 9.3 and 10.3 were last updated as far back as 7.0 or 8.0, which means the N3DS shipped with them already installed and so Nintendo culled them from the N3DS SOAP reply. These are the titles that do not actually get downgraded on the N3DS, and which are probably the root of most of the random bugs and errors that people are experiencing.
Oh and there is at least one new title on the N3DS that was included with 9.3 and won't get uninstalled when downgrading to 9.2. The Amiibo Settings application.
After doing some looking into the SOAP replies for the various N3DS and O3DS updates, I have realized I was about half right. Over the course of updates from 9.2 to 10.3, several titles were added to the N3DS SOAP replies that were already included on the system but had not been updated before.
To start with, the reason the O3DS reply has more titles is because each update must be cumulative and include titles updated in previous updates, even if the current one does not update it. Otherwise we would not be able to jump from, say, 4.5 all the way to 9.2. For the O3DS, this means some titles are included in the reply that haven't been updated since 2.x or 3.x (like the Download Play or DS Internet titles). The N3DS, however, shipped with these titles already installed so Nintendo culled them from the SOAP reply, likely to save on bandwidth. Over time several of these titles have been added to the SOAP reply for the N3DS, possibly to prepare for potential updates to those services. Nearest I can tell most of them were probably simply included in the SOAP reply without actually being updated(like a few TWL titles like DS Internet and the whitelist). But a few DID receive updates when they were included.
This brings us to the crux of the problem. Those few system services that did receive actual updates between 9.3 and 10.3 were last updated as far back as 7.0 or 8.0, which means the N3DS shipped with them already installed and so Nintendo culled them from the N3DS SOAP reply. These are the titles that do not actually get downgraded on the N3DS, and which are probably the root of most of the random bugs and errors that people are experiencing.
Oh and there is at least one new title on the N3DS that was included with 9.3 and won't get uninstalled when downgrading to 9.2. The Amiibo Settings application.
Figured I would update this to reflect what was discovered and to consolidate information.
First and foremost, there are a total of FIVE titles that you will need to check for after completing a downgrade to 9.2.
The following four titles will need to be downgraded if they have a version higher than what is listed. If any of these four titles need to be downgraded, you can acquire them from an O3DS 9.2 update/downgrade package for your region. Use sysupdater to install them.
DO NOT UNDER, ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, USE FBI TO DELETE THESE TITLES!!!
DOING SO WILL BRICK YOUR SYSTEM!!!
Details of this guide have been hidden in a spoiler in an attempt to get more people to read the above disclaimer before continuing, and hopefully cut down on the number of system bricks resulting from people not reading it.
Code:
Title ID | Version | Product Code | Service Name
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
0004001B00010802 | 0x0 | <N/A> | N/A
0004009B00010402 | 0x1002 | <N/A> | N/A)
0004013000001A02 | 0x1400 | 0430builder | DSP system-module
0004013000001B02 | 0x800 | 0328builder | GPIO system-moduleYou will also find ONE of the following titles installed. These are region specific, so you will only find the title for your region (or you SHOULD only find that one anyways). This title is not normally present on 9.2 systems as it was first installed with the 9.3 update. You can safely delete it using FBI if you wish. However you may also simply leave it alone since nothing will call or reference it on a 9.2 system. If you are comfortable deleting titles from your NAND with FBI, feel free to delete it. If you are uncomfortable doing so, simply leave it be and no harm will come of doing so.
Code:
Title ID | Version | Product Code | Service Name
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
0004003000009E02 | 0x7 | [CTR-N-HA3E] | USA amiibo settings
000400300000B902 | 0x7 | [CTR-N-HA3P] | EUR amiibo settings
0004003000009502 | 0x7 | [CTR-N-HA3J] | JAP amiibo settings
0004003000008C02 | 0x407 | [CTR-N-HA3K] | KOR amiibo settingsFinally, if you are doing your own research you might see the following titles start showing up in N3DS updates with 9.7 and wonder if you should remove them. I strongly suggest you simply leave them be as they are DS mode titles and as such are neccesary for DS/DSi carts and DSiWare games to function properly. They have not actually been updated since 7.x and were simply added to the update responses for the N3DS to ensure that every system has the most recent version. (Primarily to combat the practice of downgrading the DS Cart Whitelist to enable previously blocked DS flash carts like the GW Blue Card.)
Code:
Title ID | Version | Product Code | Service Name
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
0004800542383841 | 0x800 | DS INTERNET | DS Internet (DSi-mode application)
00048005484E4441 | 0x400 | dlplay | Download Play (DS-mode application)
0004800F484E4841 | 0x2c00 | <N/A> | Nintendo DS Cart WhitelistNow, to be completely honest it is a right royal pain in the ass to pour through the contents of the NAND title list in FBI and compare each of them to the title lists I compiled or to look for the titles I listed in this thread, so @moghedien was kind enough to create a homebrew tool that does it for you and generates a log of all unexpected titles or titles with mismatched versions.
That tool can be downloaded from the project's github page, located here. I will also upload the most recent version to this post as it is updated to maintain an easy location. (@moghedien if you would prefer I did not do so simple say as such and I will remove the file.)
Last edited by Aroth,
