Hardware Official 3DS Technical Discussion

[VMM]

Precisely. Another great example is early 360 and PS3 games, which didn't show much improvement over original XBox games. The difference was noticeable, but not that large.

Are you fucking kidding me?!]
Look at the comparison below:


Metal Gear Solid 3(PS2)

Metal Gear Solid 4(PS3)

 

[TripleSMoon]

Metal Gear Solid 4 wasn't an early PS3 game. It was released 2 years into its lifespan. I'm talking about EARLY current gen games compared to late last gen games.

 

[DiscostewSM]

Let's think about a few things here.

We all know the 3DS can do things that the GC can't do visually (which already proves the superiority of the 3DS), and we also know that even in hardware, it takes more time to process visuals the more effects you enter into the formula. So, if we were able to take out all effects that the GC can't do from the processing the 3DS does, then we'd have a good comparison about which was more powerful, since they'd do the same thing. Because the 3DS's GPU could now process more by not having to deal with everything the GC can't, its efficiency with what is left is increased. If we attempted to try and get the GC in its current state to do all that the 3DS could, it would be incapable of running games at a decent rate because the hardware to handle those effect isn't there and would require a software solution.

Since we are talking about comparing the 3DS to the GC now, it seems there is no need to debate the comparison of the 3DS to the PSP, since it is also a known fact that the PSP is incapable of handling the capabilities of the PS2, and the PS2 is incapable of handling the capabilities of the GC. Because of the point above, however, it seems that the 3DS has already past the GC in capabilities, and now ranges between that and the Wii.

 

[Gnargle]

Off-topic, but I would say that there is no game on 360 or PS3 that actually looks better than Wind Waker, despite WW being nearly ten years old and the 360 and PS3 being at the end of their life cycle.

Ehhhh, debatably, sure (Wind Waker is my second favorite game of all time). But I think that's more to do with Wind Waker's unique style. the cell shaded graphics allowed Wind Waker to sacrifice detail for smoothness. Where as most games on HD systems go for extreme detail. I think Little Big Planet is a great example of a PS3 game that has a unique art style that's very smooth, but is also very detailed.

Exactly - art style > GRAFICS. Just look at Portal 2, Half-Life 2 and TF2 - Source is rather outdated but stupidly good looking because of Valve's fantastic artists.
Dishonoured is going in the same direction, and it's great.

 

[TripleSMoon]

Exactly - art style > GRAFICS. Just look at Portal 2, Half-Life 2 and TF2 - Source is rather outdated but stupidly good looking because of Valve's fantastic artists.
Dishonoured is going in the same direction, and it's great.

I'm really looking forward to seeing what Nintendo does with its trademark art styles on the Wii U.

 

[Rydian]

Source is rather outdated

That's a common misconception... Source gets new versions, just they're all called "Source" to the end-user to avoid confusion.
As for how Source is presented to developers, the various versions are usually just "Source YEAR".

For example Source 2005 added HDR rendering (lost Coast tech demo), Source 2007 is used for The Orange Box games, Source 2012 is the latest and was the update that added official OSX support, etc.

 

[Gnargle]

Source is rather outdated

That's a common misconception... Source gets new versions, just they're all called "Source" to the end-user to avoid confusion.
As for how Source is presented to developers, the various versions are usually just "Source YEAR".

For example Source 2005 added HDR rendering (lost Coast tech demo), Source 2007 is used for The Orange Box games, Source 2012 is the latest and was the update that added official OSX support, etc.

I know that Source is regularly updated, but the fact is that it's still way behind other engines nowadays. Neither texture nor landscape streaming are supported by Source, which means that maps on Source have to be very small - widely considered as one of the reasons HL3 is taking so long. Small maps for a shooter nowadays is really unacceptable, and it's presumed that for this very reason (among others) that HL3 is going to be on Source 2 now.

 

[VMM]

@VMM

REALLY? Did you seriously start a argument about whether the 3DS is more powerful then the PSP and then compare the gap to the Vita, then post bland unimpressive screens and compare them to full detail close up shots in an arguement with Soulx.

You must be stupid.

[which in itself is invalid as a point here since you looked up Cooperation, not Co-Op

You don't even know what co-op stands for and say I'm the stupid one

For me, if you play versus on a co-op game you're probably one of these:

1) stupid
2) mentally disabled

I still don't know in which category do you fit

Meh, he's jumping all over the place in a blind and vain effort to avoid admitting he's wrong, as usual. How much you want to bet he posts a reply that says something like, "I don't know why you're so angry about this or taking me seriously. In fact, I'm just laughing about this the whole time," as usual?

I was finding that topic funny because once I told him he was doing it wrong he got mad and angry.
We don't need to get on that topic again, do we?
To say the truth you probably know I was right. Soulx and even the dictionary agreed with me.

Metal Gear Solid 4 wasn't an early PS3 game. It was released 2 years into its lifespan. I'm talking about EARLY current gen games compared to late last gen games.

MGS4 was released 1 year and 6 months after PS3 release, 3DS have 1 year and 6 months now.

Even if we take a look at one of the first PS3 releases and compare with one similar game from late's PS2 life-cycle we can see a huge difference

NBA2K5 (PS2)

NBA 2K7(PS3)

If we make a comparison of PSP and PSVita we can see a huge difference too.

Mortal Kombat Unchained(PSP)

Mortal Kombat 9(PSVita)

But then when we compare PSP to 3DS the graphical and power difference is far from that, and then I say it's anything but a huge gap.

 

[Deleted_171835]

Why are you comparing the jump from the PS2->PS3 to the jump from the PSP->3DS. I wasn't arguing that it was that large.

All I was saying was that the 3DS isn't exactly similar to the PSP and is a significant amount more powerful. It might not be a generational gap but it's still sizeable (and is certainly no Gamecube->Wii).

 

[TripleSMoon]

For me, if you play versus on a co-op game you're probably one of these:

1) stupid
2) mentally disabled

I still don't know in which category do you fit

A) You're the one who brought it up again. If you don't want to argue about it again, don't bring it up, genius. And in a different thread, too. Really?

B) And that's where the disagreement begins. You're not just saying that co-op isn't meant for versus, or even arguing that the developers didn't design certain co-op elements with certain versus elements in mind (which is not only ridiculous, but completely false, look up reviews of NSMB Wii, and you'll see that most people agree with me), but you're basically saying that anyone who does so is being stupid or retarded. If you have nothing better to do than insult people for playing a game differently from the way you do, then you really need to get a life.

C) And that's the last thing I'll say on this stupid debate that you've pointlessly brought up again IN A DIFFERENT THREAD.

 

[Ergo]

Did I really just read an argument that the 3DS isn't a huge leap over the PSP, graphically? Do those of you making the argument that the PSP and 3DS are close in power actually own both platforms? Have you seen RE: Revelations which is an *obvious* order of magnitude beyond anything the PSP has come even close to displaying in its best games, graphically? Ye gods, some (one?) of you needs to get your eyes checked (or replaced).

 

[TripleSMoon]

Did I really just read an argument that the 3DS isn't a huge leap over the PSP, graphically? Do those of you making the argument that the PSP and 3DS are close in power actually own both platforms? Have you seen RE: Revelations which is an *obvious* order of magnitude beyond anything the PSP has come even close to displaying in its best games, graphically? Ye gods, some (one?) of you needs to get your eyes checked (or replaced).

If it restores your faith in humanity at all, it's just one guy saying that.

 

[Rizsparky]

The best way that I would describe the graphical power of the PSP, 3DS and Vita is,

PSP = Low end/early PS2 graphics
3DS = High end/Late PS2 graphics
Vita = Low end PS3 graphics

 

[chris888222]

I am a massive noob but...

I'm a bit surprised that the 3DS can produce much better graphics than PSP, even if it has a lower resolution screen (400x240 VS 480x272)

Biohazard, DOA, Monster Hunter and Theathrhythm look good to amazing.

 

[Rydian]

Well the PSP's over 8 years old, and even though Nintendo has a recent habit of making systems underpowered, that "underpowered" is relative. A low-end mobile CPU from today is still much faster than a high-end mobile CPU from 8 years ago.

EDIT: Forgot the second "mobile".

 

[The Milkman]

I am a massive noob but...

I'm a bit surprised that the 3DS can produce much better graphics than PSP, even if it has a lower resolution screen (400x240 VS 480x272)

Biohazard, DOA, Monster Hunter and Theathrhythm look good to amazing.

Yeah, see the magic here is that the 3DS uses an AMAZING lighting engine (one thats even up there with the Vita's) and also has some form of AA, things like that factor how good the games look alot more then res.


@[member='VMM']


Ahem, hello fellow GBAtemp members, this is what I like to call:

Someone whos taking the Internet WAAAAAYYYY too serious.

Why have I come to this conclusion you ask? Well theres the fact that the quoted post (the second one) was from another topic that not only have virtually nothing to do with the current discussion but it itself was an offtopic argument for the topic it was posted in. Pretty bad right? It gets worse, see that ranting hes doing about me "Doing it wrong" is based on a opinion that apparently, im not allowed to play games how I would like to.

That all sound flimsy and stupid to you yet? Well, for some reason THIS suddenly validates every point he made while arguing with Soulx.

Now if you dont mind, ill finish this post by fixing an error I made earlier.

@[member='VMM']

REALLY? Did you seriously start a argument about whether the 3DS is more powerful then the PSP and then compare the gap to the Vita, then post bland unimpressive screens and compare them to full detail close up shots in an arguement with Soulx, then get butthurt over the fact your entire argument didnt even accomplish anything and try to cover the fact by digging up an old argument to make me seem stupid in return. To quote an old friend, "Your grasping at the straws here"

Without a doubt you arent only stupid, but you also take these conversations way too seriously and seem to have a bit of a "god complex" when it comes to whether your right or wrong and matter thats are simply opinions.

Offtopic: XD, Soo many quotes I messed up the post but you get the message right?

 

[RodrigoDavy]

C'mon, you're being too harsh with VMM, let's compare these other two games:

PSP

3DS

Now you can clearly see the PSP is more powerful than the 3DS, end of discussion. =D

 

[1stClassZackFair]

3ds

psp

 

[Rydian]

Here's an actual from-PSP screenshot of Tekken 6.

Remember that a lot of teaser or ad images for games are NOT taken right off the system (especially when dealing with portables) and are often touched-up. Notice the lack of anti-aliasing.

 

[The Milkman]

C'mon, you're being too harsh with VMM, let's compare these other two games:

PSP

3DS

Now you can clearly see the PSP is more powerful than the 3DS, end of discussion. =D

LOL

Even NSMB2 looks better then Mortal Combat.