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Do you believe Russia hacked the US election?

What do you think is really going on? Let's get a little political here.

I assume you've all heard of the recent Vermont power grid "hacking" story. A few days ago a Vermont utility company found a russian virus on some guy's computer and (part of) the press extrapolated the fact, turning it into a so-called proof of a Russian conspiracy to hack the US power grid... That title was a fucking clickbait, and I just knew it. But not just your average buzzshit clickbait, a serious fucking one this time. When you read the article it became clear: pure bullshit. No evidence whatsoever, all that happened is that they found a regular virus on a random guy's computer, which happens a million times a day everywhere in the world. A few hours later they retracted, a lot of other sites and agencies stated that there was no such thing as a power grid hack attempt. Those media outlets jumped to conclusions to serve their own agenda, it seems.

Now regarding the "hacking" of the US election. Several US government agencies are claiming it's real. Are we being lied to? Are the FBI and homeland security and others all following orders of a higher instance or do they have actual evidence?
So far, they haven't shared much with the general public. Last week they released a document, which I read, but if you read it too you will find that it's absolutely empty of evidence. All it states is "we found some IP addresses in the logs" and "we found a bit of code that was used before". That amounts to nothing at all.

So why do they keep going on about this?
Do you think these agencies have insights they cant share with the public? could they have informants within the russian goverment? that's one of the few things I can think of that they would never be able to reveal. Or maybe it is just more political bullshit... but what's the point? Trump will take office soon and all this Russia crap isn't working. Apparently Trump has something to say on the subject that he will reveal on tuesday or wednesday. I wonder what that may be.

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TotalInsanity4

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Because that sentence just reeks of bias, oh yes.../s
It's not that it's biased, it's that she's already f@#!%*& been investigated. Our current President made a "yuje" deal about that on the campaign trail

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I don't know if I have or not, as politics isn't my favorite subject at all, even less so when I try to express my opinions. Sometimes, like right now, I feel I'd be better if I just shut my festering gob and right out not express my views at all. Just another
example of being too bloody hard on myself *sigh*.
Nah dude you're good. Its better that stuff like this actually gets discussed, because then at least (hopefully) one side or the other learns something
 
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the_randomizer

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It's not that it's biased, it's that she's already f@#!%*& been investigated. Our current President made a "yuje" deal about that on the campaign trail

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


Nah dude you're good. Its better that stuff like this actually gets discussed, because then at least (hopefully) one side or the other learns something

I suppose that is fair enough, but I've been having a helluva time thinking right at all due to stress and anxiety regarding my current employment situation; it's been putting a toll on my ability to have proper, cognitive thoughts.
 
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smf

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You want to know why I didn't want Clinton to win? Because she supports that damned TPP bullshit, which would've royally screwed over so many people on the internet.

The same people that told you that TPP was bad for America and good for everyone else was telling everyone on the other side of the pond that the TPP was bad for us and good for America. It came down to it not being good for all of Trump and his rich buddies.

You royally got screwed.
 

the_randomizer

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The same people that told you that TPP was bad for America and good for everyone else was telling everyone on the other side of the pond that the TPP was bad for us and good for America. It came down to it not being good for all of Trump and his rich buddies.

You royally got screwed.

Think what you want, I just didn't want her to win, but whatever.
 

RevPokemon

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The same people that told you that TPP was bad for America and good for everyone else was telling everyone on the other side of the pond that the TPP was bad for us and good for America. It came down to it not being good for all of Trump and his rich buddies.

You royally got screwed.
Hillary losing was still a net-good in some respects as it lowers the Democratic Party's corporatist powers since it's main people have less power in the party now and people like Justice Democrats and Brand New Congress have a chance. Plus either way with Clinton, America was fucking screwed with her...
 
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grossaffe

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The way I see the Trump/Clinton thing is that Trump won't be able to accomplish most of the things he wants to do that I disagree with. Clinton would have.
 
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He's also becoming exactly what he mocked Clinton for on the campaign trail
But with Trump, he never really hid anything in some sense. Did he lie? Yes but he constantly would say something that makes you realize he is BSing. This is one of those times... But again, Clinton is guilty of this as well...
 

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That... somehow doesn't make it any better
It is not supposed to. We have been so accustomed to Bullshitting that we think it is normal and acceptable behavior. Why else do we give passes to those who voted for Iraq who cry that "well we thought thought they had WMDs"
 
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ThisIsDaAccount

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I think the smartest thing to do on the subject of Trump's Russian is wait for the special prosecutor's decision. Not unlike the Clinton email investigation, liberals insist that Trump is Nixon 2.0, while conservatives push that he did nothing wrong. No one side or source will have the unfiltered truth, and they are all influenced by their opinion on Trump's policies. Meanwhile, former FBI Director Mueller, the special prosecutor, does not appear to have any conflicts of interest, and I do very much trust him, and our legal system, in its ability to reach a just conclusion.

I think that a lot of do forget how good the American legal system is in terms of fishing out irregularities in top government officials. In my birth country, Argentina, a prosector set to testify on the (now former) President in Congress was shot the day before, with the death ruled a suicide. The government in the US would not be able to pull off something like that, because our bureaucrats really are decent people. Nor do I really believe that assassinating Mr. Mueller would ever cross Trump's mind.

As far as how I personally think this will turn out, I'm not completely certain. I think Trump's lack of experience with politics definitely led him to to bring in some questionable people, and I do think that some of Trump's associates are guilty of illegal contacts. Whether Trump himself even knew is ambiguous, so that will be Mr. Mueller's biggest question.
 
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UltraDolphinRevolution

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Did you know that wikipedia is not politically neutral? A swiss Prof. called Ganser and many of his friends tried to change his article which claims that he is a conspiracy theorist, even though he has a PhD in history (for investigating NATO stay behind armies in Europe) because he dares to question the US government explanation for 9/11.

The alleged Russian interference is discussed in a huge article on wikipedia as well, but there is no talk of a conspiracy theory. There are anonymous users with higher ranks at wikipedia which edit articles and have to power to ban people.

The term is used to link real investigators to people who talk about Aliens building the pyramids and other nonsense so that the majority doesn't listen to them.
Conspiracies happen all the time. If you cheat on your wife it's conspiracy (you plus the other woman vs your wife) and if she finds lipstick on your body, it's a "conspiracy theory".
 
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grossaffe

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Did you know that wikipedia is not politically neutral? A swiss Prof. called Ganser and many of his friends tried to change his article which claims that he is a conspiracy theorist, even though he has a PhD in history (for investigating NATO stay behind armies in Europe) because he dares to question the US government explanation for 9/11.
what an injustice.
 
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UltraDolphinRevolution

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I personally wouldn't mind being called a theorist of anything. But you can't deny it's used to silence people. Mass media is theorizing like crazy about a Russian conspiracy but rarely do I hear them being called conspiracy theorists.
 
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The 'Russia this, Russia that' joke has gone a little far too long now. To think that people believe Russia had anything to do with it shows that it's incredibly easy to deceive humans into thinking what they want, oh wait... 1984.



This is one of the reasons I stopped trusting news on TV and newspaper, in general. You're better off double-checking news yourself on the web for its authenticity than to rely on a news outlet who preys on always the same kind of news and then you notice their pattern.

For example, there are some sick news outlet which love to describe bit by bit how a crime was committed and even show the actual body(ies) so that their ratings can be improved. No shame whatsoever. These people are cold, cold hearted.
 

TotalInsanity4

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The 'Russia this, Russia that' joke has gone a little far too long now. To think that people believe Russia had anything to do with it shows that it's incredibly easy to deceive humans into thinking what they want, oh wait... 1984.



This is one of the reasons I stopped trusting news on TV and newspaper, in general. You're better off double-checking news yourself on the web for its authenticity than to rely on a news outlet who preys on always the same kind of news and then you notice their pattern.

For example, there are some sick news outlet which love to describe bit by bit how a crime was committed and even show the actual body(ies) so that their ratings can be improved. No shame whatsoever. These people are cold, cold hearted.

See the thing I don't get is how two independent federal agencies can say there's evidence of tampering. I mean, even if it's being overstated/misreported, there HAS to be truth to it, right?...

And yes, I've listened to the Veritas recording, I think it's pretty disguisting that CNN higher-ups are trying to control the narrative with no tangible proof. I could understand it if they had sources they want to keep secret, but this just makes it sound like it's for their own pockets
 

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See the thing I don't get is how two independent federal agencies can say there's evidence of tampering. I mean, even if it's being overstated/misreported, there HAS to be truth to it, right?...
It depends since historically it has a group of people who systematically and carefully know how to use manipulation to achieve its goals...


And yes, I've listened to the Veritas recording, I think it's pretty disguisting that CNN higher-ups are trying to control the narrative with no tangible proof. I could understand it if they had sources they want to keep secret, but this just makes it sound like it's for their own pockets
All cable news is pure bullshit. Get your news online where it is better generally.
 

TotalInsanity4

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All cable news is pure bullshit. Get your news online where it is better generally.
I'm going to have to disagree there; at least networked media is held to some semblance of a standard, whereas online media can easily be faked with no consequences to the individual writing it. Obviously corruption is a factor, but then it kind of is in anything, and has been since things with monetary value existed
 
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