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Corruption In Games Journalism, or "Five Guys Burgers and Fries"
- Thread starter Gahars
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I'm saying that sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.
Hot off the presses!
https://archive.today/BPlJF
Now for a word from Ezra Klein, Editor in Chief of Vox (which is under the same umbrella as Polygon) and creator of the JournoList, the colluding discussion board that inspired the GameJournoPros list:
Never forget that we are dealing with full on cray-cray here.
https://archive.today/BPlJF
Now for a word from Ezra Klein, Editor in Chief of Vox (which is under the same umbrella as Polygon) and creator of the JournoList, the colluding discussion board that inspired the GameJournoPros list:
Never forget that we are dealing with full on cray-cray here.
So, we should just lock up people because someone said they were raped by said person? Without a trail?
That's advanced stupidity (or going fullmcintosh ).....
It's not like people falsely accuse others of rape for personal gain :/
Offtopic.
Talking about herrasment, I've been bullied till the second half of my 4th year of highschool (which was five years long, I was about 17 years old at that time, now almost 23). I even got attacked once by the "main bully", but that didn't work out well for him
(He literally couldn't hurt me and he got suspended).
Be it for my red hair, my long build, being a geek, a nerd, getting higher grades.
One of the few places none of those things matter are games :/ The only thing you're judged on is your behaviour and skill.
That's advanced stupidity (or going fullmcintosh ).....
It's not like people falsely accuse others of rape for personal gain :/
Offtopic.
Talking about herrasment, I've been bullied till the second half of my 4th year of highschool (which was five years long, I was about 17 years old at that time, now almost 23). I even got attacked once by the "main bully", but that didn't work out well for him
(He literally couldn't hurt me and he got suspended).Be it for my red hair, my long build, being a geek, a nerd, getting higher grades.
One of the few places none of those things matter are games :/ The only thing you're judged on is your behaviour and skill.
Hey guys, I'm not really sure if I should respond to stuff you all said because I'm really not interested in arguing anymore. Part of me really wants to, though, because I disagree with some stuff that was said, but it's the off-topic stuff, and I'm not sure if it would be best.
Anyhow, on topic, the form letters used to complain to Gawker advertisers is manipulation at its core. You're manipulating people into writing the letters in the best way possible for your cause. Instructions like "Don't mention Gamergate." and "Talk about how the ads make you feel." and "Mention you're offended." and stuff like that is the very definition of manipulation. HOWEVER (excuse the caps, but I wanted to make this clear so no one skips over this), I never said that was a bad thing. The anti-Gamergate side is using dirty and manipulative tactics, just as the pro-Gamergate side is. And please don't come back with saying that they started it because, again, I'm not saying these form letters are a bad thing. It's being done for a good reason.
Finally, war2thegrave, please don't try to make this class warfare stuff. That takes away from the issue and gives the anti-Gamegate side ammunition to throw up smokescreens and obfuscate the issue. This isn't about race, gender, political leaning, religion, or any other way to divide people. This is about journalistic ethics, and nothing else.
Also, please don't use the "SJW" term. It's condescending and inappropriate because I would classify Gamergate as a social justice movement. I don't want to offend you, but I've always found that term unsavory.
Edit- DCG, I'm very sorry to hear about your bullying. Unfortunately, I have a lot of experience with that (as do many others here, I'm sure). I'm glad you made it through.
Anyhow, on topic, the form letters used to complain to Gawker advertisers is manipulation at its core. You're manipulating people into writing the letters in the best way possible for your cause. Instructions like "Don't mention Gamergate." and "Talk about how the ads make you feel." and "Mention you're offended." and stuff like that is the very definition of manipulation. HOWEVER (excuse the caps, but I wanted to make this clear so no one skips over this), I never said that was a bad thing. The anti-Gamergate side is using dirty and manipulative tactics, just as the pro-Gamergate side is. And please don't come back with saying that they started it because, again, I'm not saying these form letters are a bad thing. It's being done for a good reason.
Finally, war2thegrave, please don't try to make this class warfare stuff. That takes away from the issue and gives the anti-Gamegate side ammunition to throw up smokescreens and obfuscate the issue. This isn't about race, gender, political leaning, religion, or any other way to divide people. This is about journalistic ethics, and nothing else.
Also, please don't use the "SJW" term. It's condescending and inappropriate because I would classify Gamergate as a social justice movement. I don't want to offend you, but I've always found that term unsavory.
Edit- DCG, I'm very sorry to hear about your bullying. Unfortunately, I have a lot of experience with that (as do many others here, I'm sure). I'm glad you made it through.
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I dislike the term SJW for the same reason I dislike the term MRA. They've become nothing but derogatory terms to dismiss tons of individual viewpoints as all being the same, basically.
Yet (at least for me) the term "SJW" seems perfect to describe a certain type of person: very proactive in regards to SJ, but being an asshole about it by dismissing everyone who doesn't agree 100% to their views as "misogynerds", "cishet scum", "modern day house niggers" who deserve to be bullied and should "go eat a bowl of knives and die". Someone who has the firm stance that everyone should just take over their believes right now without critical thinking or asking questions. Someone who has no problems using the same behaviors and slurs they pretend to work to get rid of against their perceived enemies, in other words someone "holier than thou!". Someone who excessively uses or willy-nilly redefines words like misogyny and rape (e.g. "He raped me with his eyes.": Unless he is a member of the crab people or can plop his eyes out from their sockets I believe that to be impossible) [Granted, that might be a language barrier caused misunderstanding]. Someone standing in front of the door behind which an MRA meeting is held, spewing insults through a megaphone and pulling the fire alarm ("They don't deserve free speech!")[side note: extremist MRAs are IMHO just as bad as extremist feminists]. Someone jumping stark naked on the altar of a filled to the last seat big catholic church (Cologne cathedral) during Christmas mass, shouting "I am God!" (because of tolerance I guess?).
Short tl;dr version: For me: SJW = SJ + asshole + extremism.
p.s. now that i think about it, "Social Justice Asshole" would be better suited, just like the less sexist "sand in his/her urethra" is better than "sand in his/her vagina".
Short tl;dr version: For me: SJW = SJ + asshole + extremism.
p.s. now that i think about it, "Social Justice Asshole" would be better suited, just like the less sexist "sand in his/her urethra" is better than "sand in his/her vagina".
Again, though, telling people how they can best get their point across and avoid being dismissed isn't manipulation, and again, people aren't being manipulated into sending these letters. There's nothing compelling people to do it other than personal motivation; there's no stigma or threat for not taking the time to write-in. "Manipulative" has very certain negative connotations, so that's why people object.
SJW is an apt description for a very particular type of person. I admit, it can be a problem for those unfamiliar with it ("Isn't fighting for social justice good?"). The problem with social justice warriors isn't that they "fight" for social justice, it's that they're authoritarians that hijack legitimate causes and fight for self-aggrandizement and panhandle for pity. I always thought "Social Justice Zealot" would be a more accurate term for those sorts, but it seems beyond changing at this point.
While journalistic ethics are most certainly at play here, the class of people involved in game journalism
and the cliques they associate with are a major cause of our problems.
If they had bothered to do the bare minimum of fact checking required of a journalist when Quinn made
her original overblown and inaccurate claims of harassment, instead of rushing to the aid of a damsel
in distress who happens to be a friend of a friend of a friend, than this whole event could have been
avoided nearly a year ago.
SJW is the term that they wish to identify themselves with and I think it is most fitting.
They aren't interested in any real justice, just the kind that involves no work, no change, and no risk.
the kind that sounds impressive to bleat out during social events or gatherings in order to project the image
of being involved in some kind of activism a la mode, but actually accomplishes nothing.
You don't have to tiptoe around me
I've evolved beyond being offended about stuff.
Hint #1: Never tell other people what terms to use - that's entirely up to them. Unless the term is officially recognized as a slur, you have no grounds to complain. You don't have the moral authority to decide what's right and wrong, the fact that a term offends you is completely irrelevant and your "correcting" is more condescending than using the term in the first place. Putting yourself on the moral pedestal makes you seem patronizing - that's not what you want in a debate. This hint is free of charge, I'll send you the bills for any future ones, so make the best of it!
The way I described it is that an SJW is someone who seeks to right the wrongs of everyone else and everything else. Their entire schtick is to be offended for everyone and proceed to change everything because something offends someone. Great change can come from behind a computer screen, but not from the likes of an SJW. Social Justice is a poor way to bring change in the first place and is the entire reason Not Your Shield exists.
You don't want to be seen as a derogatory item, then be reasonable. It's that simply really.
EDIT: And GamerGate is not a social justice movement. We seek accountability in an industry plagued by corruption. It's a consumer revolt pure and simple.
You don't want to be seen as a derogatory item, then be reasonable. It's that simply really.
EDIT: And GamerGate is not a social justice movement. We seek accountability in an industry plagued by corruption. It's a consumer revolt pure and simple.
I would extend that definition by saying that Social Justice Warriors "know better" when it comes to what should "offend" the "victim/s" and act accordingly, regardless of whether or not the group or person in question feels victimized or offended in any way. The usual explanation in those cases is "he/she/they is/are brainwashed by the patriarchy so much that they don't even know", which is as good a reason to kick up a fuss as any other. If anything, that fuels their resolve even more.
Precisely the image I had in mind and didn't post since I didn't want to risk facing FAST's wrath regarding reposts. ;O;
I could write a poem...?Find some OC, you lazy bum
"Voeh" by Lord Foxi4 "Byron" Qnet
Roses are red
Violets are blue
This poem is madgay
And so are you
Thank you, thank you - you're a wonderful audience! ;O;
Reposts when things are part of a response is quite fine -- see also reaction gifs. Reposts as a general addition to the topic, unless it somehow needed an actual bump (in which case many things would have gone wrong already), are not cool. Some might say I should probably try not to remember most posts in a given topic I follow, however those I shall accuse of being ableist scum as it is not like I can turn my memory off.
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Sicklyboy:
@Xdqwerty, to answer your question, they're a fusion Brit-pop/J-pop/electronic band with a woman vocalist. Flamingo is hands down their best known song but they've got a ton of other really good songs+1 -
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Sicklyboy:
For example, one of my other favorite songs from them, with some massive house music influence -+1
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